Date: Tue, 27 Apr 2010 12:18:40 -0700
Reply-To: Scott Daniel - Turbovans <scottdaniel@TURBOVANS.COM>
Sender: Vanagon Mailing List <vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com>
From: Scott Daniel - Turbovans <scottdaniel@TURBOVANS.COM>
Subject: Re: A little more on Cooling problems..inline vw in vanagon
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Hey Don ...
sounds like you have a plan now ...
that should get you where you want to be ...
a running no-cooling-system issues van.
of course pressure testing the head gasket from the pressure bottle doesn't
get anywhere near the pressure that the combustion process can produce
.....so testing 'pressure in' isn't anywhere near what 'pressure out' from
the combustion process would be.
I'm funny I guess.
I never even think about how long a job will take.
It takes what it takes.
and ....I always find so many other things that need attention, that 'one
broken thing' almost becomes incidental in the entire process.
here's a simple little trick...
and this is an example too. of why a '4 hour head gasket change' job takes
me longer...
leak test the vales with a thin fluid ...like gasoline.
the simplest way on your engine is invert the head ...
on cylinders that have the valve closed, fill the combustion chambers in the
head with gasoline..
and see how long it takes for the gas to leak past the valves. If they are
perfectly sealing .....it'll hold overnight, or until the gas evoporates.
You find one where the gas leaks out in say .......an hour ..
you know a valve is leaking there.
if you take those valves out ...you see roughness on the exhaust valve faces
usually.
( then you might get into valve job or hand-lapping at the low end,
.....which all takes time of course. )
I also leak test them by putting gas in the exhaust or intake ports ...easy
on a waterboxer head.
On your head you'd have to have manifolds off .....and cam out if you wanted
all the valves closed at once, for the test.
I have a 'real' straight edge for checking cylinder head straightness. It's
pretty precise. I would not expect a carpenter's square to be very accurate.
Typically when you take a head to a machinist they like to machine the
surface flat ..
though you can only do that so many times, so it's not always 'the right
thing to do' ..it 'depends.'
and of course....the time thing ...
if you want the head surfaced....then manifolds have to come off ..
and sometimes things are a little rusted etc......there goes that 'half day
job' thing.
The qualit and thoroughness of the job is more important than the shortness
of time period that the job took in my world.
I see someone talk about how fast they can rip an engine out of a vanagon
...
I'm like .......what is the point of that ? I want to hear about how
carefully without damaging anything someone can remove an engine , and they
about how well they fix all the little rusted/loose/left off/damaged/funky
previous work/ even the flat wrong parts used....etc. etc.
most of my '4 hour jobs' take way, way longer than that. The vans are 20+
years old. There is often a LOT that needs attention to make things really
right again ..
not that your personal van isn't in top notch condition throughout, of
course . :-)
the plastic fuel rail on your engine ...they seem to work, but that always
looked a little shakey to me .....
must be darn good plastic, but still.....
a metal part there would be great.
scott
www.turbovans.com
----- Original Message -----
From: "Don Hanson" <dhanson928@GMAIL.COM>
To: <vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM>
Sent: Tuesday, April 27, 2010 7:34 AM
Subject: A little more on Cooling problems..inline vw in vanagon
> Yesterday I went over my '92 Golf/Jetta/Rabbit gas-powered 1.8liter VW
> inline van (84 low top westie) following up on some suggestions from
> helpful
> list members, chasing down some strange cooling system behavior I began
> seeing recently.
> I've seen a change to cooler than normal operating temps...until it
> boiled over on Sunday. I've had excess coolant level in the overflow
> tank,
> too. No loss of power or poor running..just the temperature anomalies.
>
> So I pulled the plugs (they alll look perfect) and put about 20psi
> compressed air into the coolant pressure tank, then listened (with a pipe)
> to each spark plug hole for escaping coolant coming into the cylinder.
> Nothing. I blew out the pressure cap on the coolant pressure res. and
> replaced the hose to the overflow tank..it was a bit old and possibly
> leaky. I found my spare thermostat and tested it in boiling water, then
> replaced the one in the van with that. I shut down the valve to the rear
> heater and inspected all the hoses and connections everywhere. Then I
> re-filled and re-bled the cooling system very carefully.
>
> Alas! I still see some bubbles coming into the pressure
> reservoir..confirming I probably will still see head gasket or head
> (proper)
> problems. So I found and ordered parts online..$31 for the headgasket
> and
> $27 for new headbolts and washers. When those arrive, I'll be pulling the
> head (which you can do with the motor in the van) to see where the
> combustion gasses are escaping into the coolant.
> I've also been putting off installing a billet aluminum fuel injector
> rail
> (fire prevention measure), now I can do that. If the head is not damaged,
> I
> don't even have to touch the valves or camshaft, so the R&R of the
> headgasket should be about 1/2 day's process...if I don't break anything
> and
> do it correctly the first time.
>
> I'm posting this to perhaps give some data to those with problematic
> motors in vanagons. To those who may be debating either fixing their
> engine
> problems, rebuilding their existing motors or choosing one of the
> engine-swaps, you might be interested in the relative repair simplicity
> and
> economy of an inline VW gas motors. I am not advocating "My" type engine
> as
> the best in a vanagon...I am truthfully relating the experience I've had.
> I've been finding this van remarkably inexpensive and simple with adequate
> performance and good fuel consumption. ~$60 and half a day in your garage
> with hand tools, you can't beat that for a leaky combustion chamber
> problem
> repair, can ya? (I know..."Best case scenario only")
>
> I probably should have had the head surfaced professionally when I
> replaced a headgasket about 35k miles ago. That time, I screwed up the
> bleeding process, being new to Vanagon cooling systems, and overheated my
> motor. I assessed the head's true-ness with my steel carpenter's framing
> square, then lapped it a little on a piece of plate glass, deciding that
> was
> probably "good enuf" but I probably should have sent it out to a
> machinist..
>
> Don Hanson
