Date: Mon, 26 Jul 2010 15:59:23 -0700
Reply-To: Scott Daniel - Turbovans <scottdaniel@TURBOVANS.COM>
Sender: Vanagon Mailing List <vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com>
From: Scott Daniel - Turbovans <scottdaniel@TURBOVANS.COM>
Subject: Re: Hi and newby question
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of course, with only the information that it's an 83,
it could be one of three totally different vanagons.
it could be a late air-cooled one. If it has only the headlight grill on the
front, it's air-cooled.
it could be a rare and very very diseraible 19893 5 speed diesel Westy ,
or it could be a 83.5 waterboxer.
those are 'not bad'.. 83.5 westy's .
early westy's have funky door panels on the sliding door inside,
the 84 and earlier sliding door is not so hot ....( though not bad if you
remove the inside panel, adjust the cable there some, and lube *everything*
...then theyopen OK from the outside, not bad at all actually )
An 83 waterboxer won't have power steering of course ..
and the way to view that is less complexity and things to go wrong. Power
Steering racks on vanagons are sort of like transmission..
mostly they work fine until one day it's finally shot ..and you need a whole
new one. Nice to have though, on a vangon , PS ....power steering can be
retro-fitted to any vanagon ..but it's a lot of work.
in the 83 you have to cut out some notches in the frame edge alongside the
gas tank ..
t route the pipes through those notches. All 84's and up already have that
feature.
anyway ..
what to look for ?
hundreds of things.
the single biggest is rust.
if the interior is OK, the tent and top ok ...
and body not rusted or crashed ..
even tired engine or transmission is easy to deal with relatively speaking.
I sold a really good looking 83.5 Westy ..in 'aswan brown' ..which is really
'southwest terracta red in my opinion ...super excellent orignal paint, good
tent .....fully sorted from one end to the other ..
alloy wheels, 2.1 engine with fresh head gaskets and valve work ...
just a fine working westy ...........sold it for $ 5,700 .......and that
was with about 5K in work done to it ( bought it running for 1,000 ...with
'many issues' ) . I did a ton of rust repair on that van too ..
no bady cancer, but almost.
Surface rust is super easy to deal with ! no a problem at all really ..
if you let it get to holes and real cancer though ....super bad news. Easy
to treat and stop before it gets to that stage. Heck, I can treat a surface
rust spot and stop if from rusting again for years and years, in a matter of
seconds, it's that easy with the right stuff.
2.1'a have their issues too ..
namely more plastic cooling system parts that break easily, some of which
you almost can't get ...
the electionically controlled idle system can be expensive to repair ..
they do have more power.
and the exhaust system on a 2.1 is much better than the one on the 1.9 wbxr.
what I like ...I run a combination of the two..
2.1 engine mainly....
and 1.9 cooling system and fuel injection.
I find that combo runs really well, 2.1 with digijet fuel infecion.
i'm adding an oil cooler/heat exchanger to the 1.9 cooling system too, to
retain that 2.1 feature
and for that matter I'd really like a 'real' oil cooler.
just put on on a Syncro vanagon for a guy ..
really slick little air type oil cooler that goes behind the right tail
light.
thermsotat controlled so it doesn't over cool the oil.
on the versin for syncro there's a temp sensor triggered boost fan ..
nice set up.
expensive ....500ish ...but you only need to buy it once,
and I'm sure it's got to help engine life in hot running condtions. probabl
worth 40 degrees F lower oil tempin really hot conditons.
just shop carefully...
here's what I do , and I LOVE checking out cars ...
I just add up all the things it needs to get up to full raodworthiness..
say shocks are medium tired, or tired are car 'P' tires ..
a side marker light is out .
the brake fluid looks like thin black water, whatever..
I just add all that up.
Commonly, 'used van' could use a grand invested in serciing and repairing
...easily.
first question is YES or NO ..do I want this van in my life, even if it's
free.
Get a flat yes or no on that ..
if you can visualize owning it and living with it and doing whatever it
needs to be really healthy ..
then the next question is price.
if the answer is 'no, not even for free would I want this in my live' ..then
you move on.
but say it's asking price 5K and it needs .........this would be typcial
even ..
a thou in negelected service and this and that's here and there..
then you use that information, on what it needs in dollars to get it right
..
to caluclate your offer on it.
anyway, shop carefully ..
look for the least rusted Westy you can find and afford is what I say.
I'm getting a little closer to it being ready for sale every day ..
not quite ready yet, daily insured and registered driver though ..
85 Westy GL that's not rusted, PS, manual trans, some scracthes and minor
dents..
excellent tent, fully serivced through out , like very well sorted out in
every way , as good as I can get it , like $ 5K of fresh work on it
...missing stove, sink, fridge and propane tank, so it's a Faux Weekedner
..that'll be up for sale soon .....6K ish depending on what all I do to it
and how good I get it ..possibly more if I'm super pleased with how good I
get it overall, including some interior work.
great opportunity for someone who wants to make their own custom kitchen
area.
should be quite good ....fresh head gaskets and valve work, new water pump,
new muffler ..
and excellent products used throughout servicing the entire van from one end
to the other.
later ..
and welcome and hope you get a fine van soon !
and of course...the later series...86 and up are more desireable..
but thnose rectangular headlights ...ultimately you'll want the single round
ones with euro type lenses and bulbs...then you'll have bright, affordable,
repairable head lights. the 86 and later are generally not that great,
expesnive to replace, and the plastic adjusters break and you almst can't
get those. ..
but yeah, later is better, though a *good* pre-86 is not bad at all, if you
can find one. 85 is a very good year btw....transission year...latest
version of the early series. First year of a much better sliding door too.
btw..for anyone wanting a rust free body/chassis to use to put all your good
stuff from your badly rusted van onto ..I have a few of those for sale,
mostly 84/85. Like 'major project' ...one 85 I have has one small dent,
lived in the desert it's whole life. zero rust, have title, don't want much
for it, under $ 1K for sure. Be an excellent basis for a totally rust-free
and never crahsed 85 body/chassis, to start building something really good
from.
scott
www.turbovans.com
----- Original Message -----
From: "Jim Felder" <jim.felder@GMAIL.COM>
To: <vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM>
Sent: Monday, July 26, 2010 2:43 PM
Subject: Re: Hi and newby question
If it's an 83 it may be a diesel. It would be worth more to someone
like me and less to others because of that.
The little diesel engine is probably good for 100K miles in a vanagon
before something--the pump, the head, something--needs attention. It
it's an early 83 then it has a five speed, which, if it is in good
condition, ought to be worth a thousand more in my opinion.
If it's a late 83, then it's gas. Nothing wrong with the 1.9 engine
which should go 200K miles or more in the vanagon. But that's a
generalized statement, in all cases it depends on who rebuilt it and
how and with what.
You'll need to look on the samba.com and ebay to get an idea of the
price in your area. Vanagons vary a lot in price around the country.
If it's rust-free, good running and working and well maintained,
complete and original, then it might be worth 5-6K, but I'm no expert.
Most of them are worth around 4K and outstanding examples are maybe
10K.
Many of them are kind of dogged out and worth about 2K. You really
should report on the details of the screens, camping equipment,
canvast top, body, steering, seats, etc. because there are thousands
and thousands of dollars hiding there even if the drive train and body
are great.
I'm sure others will chime in.
Welcome to vanagon world, it's not just a car but a point of view. Or
thousands of them as you will find out from this list. At least you'll
never need that manometer to balance another SU carbuettor or bang on
the bulkhead with a bottle to keep that pump going.
Jim
On Mon, Jul 26, 2010 at 2:44 PM, Peters, David Gerard <dgp6@pitt.edu> wrote:
> Hi All
>
> Just discovered this list. Excellent stuff!!
>
> I am a newby to Vanagons. Being a Brit I have owned Land Rovers and
> unreliable English sports cars (all rough).
>
> I am now living in Pittsburgh and have been looking endlessly for a Westy
> nearby. I was hoping for a late model full camper with a 2.1 engine but
> have seen a 1983 model nearby. It is described as being in good condition
> and has had replacement engine and clutch although neither went in
> recently (50k miles ago).
>
> Can anybody advise as to a sensible price range? What should I be looking
> out for when I view it?
>
> Thanks
>
> Dave
