Date: Wed, 15 Sep 2010 20:05:34 -0500
Reply-To: mcneely4@COX.NET
Sender: Vanagon Mailing List <vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com>
From: Dave Mcneely <mcneely4@COX.NET>
Subject: Re: I am considering installing an auxiliary oil cooler
In-Reply-To: <1284594267.2166.3.camel@TheJackUbuntuNetbook>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8
Mr. Squirrel, the reason I am considering an oil cooler for my '91 Vanagon GL Campmobile 2.1 L waterboxer is that I drive it at high ambient temperatures -- 95 F and higher, even well over 105 F, on long highway treks. When I do, the oil pressure drops well below 20 psi, down to around 15 psi, and when I drop to idle, it goes low enough to trigger the oil pressure warning light to briefly come on. When I shut it off, even for moments, then restart, the light does not come on, but when it does come on, it is more than flickering. I noticed this past summer, on such a drive, that when a thunderstorm dropped the ambient temperature to the fifties, the oil pressure rose to around 45 psi. That was in fact on a steep grade -- going up Raton Pass entering Colorado from New Mexico. The pass climbs from about 5K feet to nearly 9K feet in just a few miles. On the entire trip from Oklahoma to Washington State and return, elapsed mileage almost exactly 5800 miles, the oil pressure never dropped below 30 psi at high rpm, regardless of gear and speed, unless the ambient temperature was high. At lower ambient temps the warning light never came on when I slowed to idle, either.
Some other vanagon owners have related similar experience to mine. Interesting that more than one vendor has seen fit to put together an oil cooler kit for vanagons.
BTW, on that drive up Raton Pass (we pulled over when the hail started. though it was not large hail, it was pounding down and visibility was poor) the hail accumulated to a foot deep, and there were drifts around four feet tall. Snow plows worked the highway. Quite a thunderstorm
During that trip, my van never showed any indication of overheating, and it never does. The temperature gauge rises to the LED, and sticks there. Sometimes on a long traverse at high ambient temperature the needle will move high enough for me to see the middle of the LED on the gauge, but it does not reveal the entire LED. I did a fair amount of cooling system work on the van last (2009) summer. Last summer is still 2009 here, as summer 2010 continues apace with temps reaching the mid-nineties today.
I plan to look and consider a bit more before I commit to an oil cooler. When I do, I will almost certainly get a kit. Which one -- I don't know. Maybe revealed wisdom from list members will help. The tencentlife kit is said by its seller to be super easy to install, comes with foolproof instructions, and just call the guy for a walk through if one needs it. I emailed back and forth with him about it., and even asked him what he would charge for install if I were in New Mexico and wanted it. He told me not to pay anyone to install the kit, that anyone who can handle a simple wrench and a drill, and can follow simple instructions can install the cooler kit easily. Some list members have given his product a good recommendation.
The installation that was posted for the Bus Boys kit looked more complicated than that, but then I have not seen a tencentlife installation (or the Bus Boys one) up close and personal. The tencentlife web page photo of the installation looks pretty simple and tight looking.
You are right, there is quite a price difference.
Some months back, a list member mentioned a bad experience with the Bus Boys. I have not bought anything from them. I'm sure someone has had a bad experience with every vendor of every product ever sold. Others have recommended the Bus Boys, though it does not seem to be one of the vendors most used by list members.
David
---- Rocket J Squirrel <camping.elliott@GMAIL.COM> wrote:
> Well, does anyone know whether the Bus Boys kit at
>
> <http://www.bus-boys.com/oilcoolingremote.html>
>
> is as effective as tencentlife's kit? For the 1.9L?
>
> tencentlife's kit is quite a bit more expensive than the $132 that BB
> wants for their ZAP-11705 kit.
>
> Finally, is putting on an oil cooler worthwhile? I mean, sure, it's
> awesome and cool and all that, but will my engine notice? I've gone up
> some mighty steep grades on very very hot days without overheating.
>
>
> --
> Rocky J Squirrel
>
>
> On Wed, 2010-09-15 at 15:33 -0700, Scott Daniel - Turbovans wrote:
> > any decent air type oil cooler system..
> > will have oil flow controlled by a thermostat.
> >
> > like when cold, the oil isn't cooled by the oil cooler at all.
> >
> > I just put a super nice air type oil cooler onto a 91 Syncro with 2.1 (
> > actually 2.2 ) waterboxer engine .
> >
> > this came from tencentlife on theSamba ..
> > Chris Corkin .
> > comes in 3 versions I think , his kit ...1.9 wbxr, 2.1 2WD and Sycrno.
> > I installed the top grade syncro one.
> > nice black oil radiator, about 8 or 10 inches sqare,
> > fits right behind the right tail light, comes with parts on it to make it
> > fit perfectly there.
> >
> > has a sandwich plate adapter at the oil cooler .......which is where the
> > t-stat is.
> > the deluxe syncro version has a temp triggered electric fan on it.
> >
> > and nice blue oil lines to connect it all.
> > the deluxe version I think is over 500 bucks though if you buy this
> > ready-to-bolt on kit.
> > if you buy the indifvidual parts online yourself and build it, costs less
> > I'm sure.
> > that it's all figured out, tested, and with very good instructions is sure
> > nice though...getting a kit that's all ready to install.
> >
> > for a first step on my own vans I'm going to monitor oil pressure and temp
> > ..
> > and if I find the oil temp getting to ...like pushing 250F ..then I know it
> > needs a real oil cooler for hot conditions.
> >
> > a manual valve is not right.
> > do it right. Thermostat controlled oil coolers have been around for a long,
> > long time.
> > Every air-cooled Porsche 911 has one, built right into the block.
> >
> > the water heat exchanger on 2.1 wbxr engines is a little different ..
> > it serves to help warm up the oil first, them when not serves to keep the
> > temp down a little I beleive.
> >
> > some people fit bigger water type oil cooler/heat exchangers ...
> > like on tdi engines ...instead of the normal size we are used to on 21.
> > wbxr's ..
> > they put on a much taller one from a Tourareg or various Audi models.
> >
> > but for 'real' oil cooling , for high temps and loads..
> > I'd say ..thermostatically controlled air type external oil cooler ..and
> > mounted inside the body of the van, with decent air flow to it.
> >
> > they are another possible failure point, but done really well, there's not
> > that much risk.
> > The kit I put on sure looks solidly done.
> >
> > scott
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Dave Mcneely" <mcneely4@COX.NET>
> > To: <vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM>
> > Sent: Wednesday, September 15, 2010 8:13 AM
> > Subject: I am considering installing an auxiliary oil cooler
> >
> >
> > > on my "91 Volkswagen Vanagon GL Campmobile 2.1 waterboxer.
> > >
> > > It occurred to me that if the oil cooler works well, the oil might run too
> > > cool when ambient temperatures are relatively low. Is it possible (and
> > > practical, reasonable) to install a valve in the feed line for the cooler
> > > (and maybe another in the return line) that could be opened and closed
> > > depending on need? I realize that this would create an additional
> > > complication -- that it would be another point for possible failure. Or
> > > am I just trying to over engineer something? Anyone with experience with
> > > an auxiliary oil cooler might know if I am trying to solve a problem that
> > > doesn't exist. Maybe the oil would have no problem running hot enough,
> > > even with the extra cooling capacity.
> > > Thanks, DMc
> > > --
> > > David McNeely
--
David McNeely
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