Date: Wed, 8 Dec 2010 00:00:29 -0700
Reply-To: Karl Wolz <wolzphoto@Q.COM>
Sender: Vanagon Mailing List <vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com>
From: Karl Wolz <wolzphoto@Q.COM>
Subject: Re: 91 Vanagon Manual - slow cranking....
In-Reply-To: <COL109-W3290A5BD833A50F80E10F8D42D0@phx.gbl>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Brett,
Did you polish or ream the bushing? There are a lot of brass filings in the
area. This could be indicative of binding problems.
When you jumped the starter from the remote battery, what weight cables did
you use?
You could remove the spark plugs from the engine and reduce the load just to
see if it cranks more easily.
Try augmenting the battery ground by using a heavy jumper cable from the
negative post to a known good ground area. Have you used an ohmmeter to
measure the resistance within that ground strap?
Good luck,
Karl Wolz
|-----Original Message-----
|From: Vanagon Mailing List [mailto:vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com] On Behalf Of
|brett rueff
|Sent: Tuesday, December 07, 2010 10:47 PM
|To: vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM
|Subject: Re: 91 Vanagon Manual - slow cranking....
|
|Well bit of an update. Thanks for the initial round of suggestions from all
|the regular forum guru's.- Cleaned all the ground contacts really well and
|reassambled. Made a slight difference - im probably loosing about 0.8V now
|on the negative side rather than 1V. Still not great - most of my loss is
|coming in the cable that goes from battery neg to ground in the battery
|box. I've cleaned it to sparkling new but im still loosing almost 0.5V in
|that 6-8inch cable. Might be time to replace.
|- While playing with grounds I have tried to keep the investigation process
|going. Battery has been removed and taken to FLAPS and tests as good. If
|you remember from last post starter was removed and tested good at FLAPS
|although its under no load when tested, so im suspect of the test???
|- I can easily turn the engine over by hand with a cheater bar and socket
|on the crank so there goes the tight engine theory.
|- I thought it might be the bushing - it looked pretty dry and the end of
|the starter shaft is a little scored. As a test I threw some grease in
|there, reassembled (I can remove/replace starter in about 5 minutes now!)
|and thought if there was binding some fresh grease might temporarily smooth
|it out to confirm the theory...alas - no change.
|- Finally I took a known good battery under the car and used jumper leads
|to put 12V directly to starter - its still anemic.
|With the 12V directly on the starter and still very slow crank all I can
|think of is its the starter despite its passing test at the FLAPS....
|FYI here is some pics of my starter bushing still in place:
|http://www.flickr.com/photos/55896090@N04/5243087570/
|http://www.flickr.com/photos/55896090@N04/5242491815/in/photostream/
|http://www.flickr.com/photos/55896090@N04/5242491815/in/photostream/
|
|Cheerio - somewhat frustrated about the ground issue, but will keep trying
|things.Brett
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|>
|> On 12/2/2010 9:22 PM, brett rueff wrote:
|> > ok, so I have read the archives and done some diagnosing - im looking
|for some geniuses out there to tell me im right or that i missed the
|obvious.
|> >
|> > 91 Vanagon Manual with subaru EJ22 but stock Vanagon starting system.
|Very slow cranking - it has been getting a little bit worse since I got the
|van a year ago. It would always start but had a slow crank. Its getting
|bad enough now that I need to fix it.
|> >
|> > As part of this process I cleaned the battery terminals, removed and
|cleaned the ground strap and removed and cleaned starter solenoid
|terminals.
|> >
|> > Testing with Voltmeter revealed.
|> >
|> > Battery at Rest - 12.57V (after an overnight charge to make sure its
|full)
|> > Insert Key and turn accessories on (includes headlights) - 11.63V
|> > Cranking measured across battery (+ battery post and - battery post) -
|10V
|> >
|> > Cranking measured at starter (+ on main solenoid pole - on starter
|housing) - 8.5-9V
|> >
|> > Voltage Drop positive side (+ to pos battery terminal - to solenoid
|main pole) - 0.2V
|> > Voltage Drop negative side (+ to starter housing - to neg battery
|terminal) - 1V
|> >
|> > So I concluded starter. 8.5-9V should be good enough for a cranking
|right? I removed and took it to FLAPS where they bench tested it and said
|it was fine - I watched the test and it span like mad. Reinstalled and
|still slow cranking. I am ruling out oil viscosity problems as its been
|about 7 degrees C all week here in lotus land Vancouver BC.
|> >
|> > I can only guess its still the starter and its laboring under the load
|of the engine. I read in the archives the bushing on the end of the
|starter wears and causes hard cranking. Based on my testing that is all I
|can figure is the problem. Suggestions before I pull the thing apart
|again?
|> >
|> > Thank you gang. Will post to the vanaru list as well.
|> > brett
|> >
|> >
|> >
|>
|>
|> --
|> Happy Trails,
|>
|> Greg Potts
|> Toronto, Ontario Canada
|> 197x Westfakia "Bob the Tomato"
|> 1987 Wolfsburg Weekender Hardtop (ND Graphics graphics wrap)
|> 1988 Wolfsburg Weekender Hardtop (Colleen's ride)
|> www.pottsfamily.ca
|>
|> BUSES OF THE CORN - AUGUST 12-14th, 2011
|> www.busesofthecorn.ca
|
| 
