Date: Mon, 10 Jan 2011 22:09:57 -0800
Reply-To: Scott Daniel - Turbovans <scottdaniel@TURBOVANS.COM>
Sender: Vanagon Mailing List <vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com>
From: Scott Daniel - Turbovans <scottdaniel@TURBOVANS.COM>
Subject: Re: Hard shifting - clutch mount bracket?
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hi.
eyeball your slave bracket while someone steps on the clutch pedal.
it shouldn't move or flex much at all.
is the forward support bracket for it in place ?
people leave those off sometimes...that will lead to flexing and eventually
cracking of the slave bracket.
**** first thing to determine is ...
does it shift fine with engine off ?
if it shifts fine that way, but not with engine running ..
then you start to wonder if the clutch is disengaging cleanly ..
as in bad pilot brg ( common ) ...flexing slave bracket,
lost motion somehow/somewhere, weak hydraulics etc.
how far off the floor does the clutch pedal have to be before van starts to
move.?
should be around 2 1/2 inches...
if it's less than that ......think of the hydraulics and the whole
mechanical aspects of the clutch system ...
OR ..
just a draggy pilot bearing will give that symptom ......as far as pressure
plate disengagement is concerned ....the hydraulics and everything else
could be doing their job , but the pilot brg is still preventing clean
disengagement. Not a diagnosis at all...just something to consider. Usually
pilot bearings are just 'blown out' ..like no rollers left....it might cause
other clutch problems ..but they are not 'draggy' with no rollers left in
it.
if you determine that the clutch is very cleanly and completely disengaging
..then you think all about linkage. ..or syncro's.
I just had one .....( 1.9 TD diesel engine in 85 GL with newly rebuilt
trans ) ..stiff shifting in 3rd and 4th I think..I lubed and adjusted at the
shifter plate at the base of the shifter..lubed everywhere..
didn't change a lot. Finally I decided to loosen the bracket on the side of
the trans for the shift linkage and retighten ...like let it jiggle into
'the right place' ..tighten it back down That fixed it perfectly , just that
one step.
the plastic parts in the base of the shifter ... I find those getting tired.
I also find a lot of slop in shift linkage people may not even notice .
is there much slop in your shifter ?
the pattern should be pretty clearly defined, without fore-aft free movement
of the shift knob..
or left right free movement. not over half an inch say.
I don't believe in short shift kits at all.
if it was a van I just bought ..and there was an issue with shifter
function..
and it has a short shift kit and a lever extension ..I'd get those off
pronto !
The stock system is nigh perfect.
and besides....if you put in a short shift kit, but then you extend the
lever at the top ..
there's no net gain.
furthermore ...shifter extensions that turn ...or have an angle to them ..
when you push down and go for reverse ........if it's the bent back
style...you are adding a bit of twist to the shift lever..or can ..all of
which helps wear out good stock shift linkage.
and a short shift kit adds effort of course ...
though the extension will negate some of that increased effort..
but I'd turn that back to stock immediately.
Seriously ..almost all aftermarket hot rod stuff has a downside. or it's
harder to work on, or something not as good as stock ....usually that's the
case.
make sure the lever on the side of the trans is held tightly onto the
splined shaft it sits on ..sometimes those get loose. Not likely ..but easy
to check.
Scott
www.turbovans.com
----- Original Message -----
From: "brett rueff" <rueffy@HOTMAIL.COM>
To: <vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM>
Sent: Monday, January 10, 2011 8:51 PM
Subject: Hard shifting - clutch mount bracket?
Im trying to diagnose hard shifting in a 91 Vanagon Manual with short shift
kit and shifter extension handle. Tranny would have less than 30,000 miles
on it from reputable list rebuilder. I've hit the archives hard and am not
having much luck doing past fixes.
3rd and 4th are consistently smooth shifting - not butter smooth, but pretty
comfortable. 1st and 2nd seem to be the problem child - worse downshifting
than upshifting. 2nd has some resistance and can sometimes give a small
clunk going in, and can be a bit "sticky" not wanting to come out. I have to
be going quite slow to downshift from 3rd to 2nd. 1st can only really be
engaged after coming to a complete stop (this may be normal?)
Pumping the clutch didn't really make a difference and the slave cylinder
looks near new - I guess it was done by the PO.
So far I have done 3 things. Bled slave cylinder - no change. Then switched
to MT-90 redline which made a small improvement. Also greased and lubed
inside the shifting box above the spare tire, the shaft bushing on the rear
arm and the ball and cup on the shift lever. Both had a small amount of
play before greasing. Also made a small improvement, but that sticky second
is still there. Also tried playing with the clamp adjustment using the
bently 23mm block method and then just tweaking in and around the area - no
real change. Im not opposed to spending the $$$ to R&R all the common
failure points on the shift linkage - but I would have hoped greasing them
would have made a substantial improvement to let me know I was on the right
track. The vendors also seem to describe the replacements as curing "vague"
shifting, but I wouldn't call what I have vague - its more like
notchy/clunky/grabby.
During the clutch bleed as part of this process I noticed the ring on the
mounting bracket that slips over the clutch arm moves in and out under the
clutch pressure. The whole clutch bracket is moving which is probably
"stealing"some of the clutch throw. Could that be it? Is there supposed to
be a circlip or something to stop this movement. I made a video where you
can see the movement:
http://www.vimeo.com/18651753
CheerioBrett
Also - anyone know a good vanagon mechanic in the greater vancouver area?
Im tempted to just take this in as I spent 8 hours on it today and dont seem
any closer. Im even thinking of a trip to Seattle to see Zolly or Daryl.
=
