Date: Wed, 9 Mar 2011 09:56:01 -0800
Reply-To: Jake de Villiers <crescentbeachguitar@GMAIL.COM>
Sender: Vanagon Mailing List <vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com>
From: Jake de Villiers <crescentbeachguitar@GMAIL.COM>
Subject: Re: And now - still trying for NEW TIRES
In-Reply-To: <BA97A528226E48FEBAB4F9B9A4E0E61E@RON>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
So the published data says that I need a tire that's rated for ~6% above the
normal load for my van which is ~3990 lbs.? And that passenger tires are
good for my maximum load (5000 lbs) plus 9% (450 lbs) ie 5450 lbs.?
Good to know! That means my 1709 lb winter passenger car tires and 1521 lb
summer passenger car tires should be just fine according to Chicken Little?
I made that decision all by myself some twenty years ago but thanks for the
validation. ;)
Jake
On Wed, Mar 9, 2011 at 8:52 AM, The Bus Depot <vanagon@busdepot.com> wrote:
> > Maximum load != normal load. Do you always drive your Vanagon
> > loaded to full weight capacity? The regulations certainly
> > don't expect that to be the case, and that's not what they apply to.
>
>
> Exactly. What the D.O.T. is saying is that there should be a safety margin
> -
> that "maximum load" means just that, maximum, not typical. They are saying
> that while the vehicle can be driven periodically with the maximum load
> that
> the tire can handle (if it is an LT rated tire - otherwise 9% below), on an
> ongoing basis its NORMAL load should be at least 6% BELOW the tire's rated
> capacity. This is in addition to, not instead of, meeting the maximum load
> requirement. In other words, even if the vehicle's "normal" load is 6%
> below
> the tire's maximum capacity, its potential loaded weight (based on rated
> GWVR) must also be lower than the tire's maximum capacity. Both criteria
> must be met, not just one or the other. They define normal load as having
> no
> more than 2 passengers, no luggage or cargo to speak of, and no accessories
> that add weight. Somewhere I have even seen a spec on what percentage of
> time they think a tire should be safely used at or near its maximum load,
> but I don't feel like spending hours looking for it.
>
> Bear in mind that VW Campers were sold by Volkswagen as "unfinished
> vehicles" and the GWVR is based on that designation. That is why a Westy
> and
> a Non-Westy have the same rated GWVR. So a Westy will NEVER operate at
> "normal load" - rather, it approaches "fully laden" at all times. Your
> entire camper interior, the propane and water tank, and everything you have
> in the cabinets and under the seats are over and above the "normal load." A
> Syncro also has a higher GWVR, even if it is not a Westy.
>
> In theory, it can be argued that the bare minimum tire requirement could be
> lower on a 2WD non-camper than on a camper, if it is almost always driven
> with no more than 2 passengers and no cargo to speak of. But even at the
> absolute bare minimum permitted by law - an unladen NON-Syncro NON-Camper
> with no safety margin at all, not even the recommended 6% - at 1433 lbs
> required per rear tire you still need a load index of 97 on any tire that
> not does not specifically say LT on the sidewall, or 93 on a tire that
> does.
> The slightly higher numbers on my website (99 and 95 respectively) allow
> for
> the D.O.T.'s 6% safety margin on a passenger van, or for use on a Westy.
> (If
> I were going to really break it down specifically, a Syncro should be
> slightly higher still.)
>
> So even if we substitute a slightly lower number for unladen non-Syncro
> non-Westies, does that change anything? No, not really - because in the
> real world there are virtually no tires that meet these lower numbers but
> wouldn't have met the slightly higher ones anyway. I have never seen a 93
> load index LT tire, for example. Virtually all LT tires far exceed that
> capacity, and are therefore suitable in that regard for ANY Vanagon,
> including Syncros and Westies. Conversely, most standard passenger car
> tires
> have load indexes below 97 (including, incidentally, the Michelin HydroEdge
> that GoWesty pushes), making them UNSUITABLE for any Vanagon, even an
> unladen non-Westy. A notable exception is XL (Extra-Load) rated passenger
> car tires, which are more akin to LT tires and typically exceed the specs
> by
> enough margin that they're fine for Westies and Syncros as well. The
> oddball
> is the 14" General Altimax XL, which barely squeaks by if you have a
> non-Westy non-Syncro passenger van, exceeding the legal minimum by just 71
> lbs with no additional 6% margin. (That said, I would recommend reading up
> on this tire on the Samba.)
>
> This is all based on verifiable published data, not opinions. You can look
> it up yourself. If you want to split hairs, argue that your opinion is
> more
> valid than the D.O.T.'s, and/or ignore the safety standards entirely,
> that's
> entirely up to you, and it has certainly been done ad nauseum on this list.
> I'm only stating what the published data says.
>
> - Ron Salmon
> The Bus Depot, Inc.
> www.busdepot.com
> (215) 234-VWVW
>
> _____________________________________________
> Toll-Free for Orders by PART # : 1-866-BUS-DEPOT
>
--
Jake
1984 Vanagon GL 1.9 WBX - 'The Grey Van'
1986 Westy Weekender/2.5 SOHC Subie - 'Dixie'
Crescent Beach, BC
www.thebassspa.com
www.crescentbeachguitar.com
http://subyjake.googlepages.com/mydixiedarlin%27
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