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Date:         Wed, 9 Mar 2011 14:57:26 -0500
Reply-To:     Jim Johnston <inmytree1@GMAIL.COM>
Sender:       Vanagon Mailing List <vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com>
From:         Jim Johnston <inmytree1@GMAIL.COM>
Subject:      Re: And now - still trying for NEW TIRES
Comments: To: Mike S <mikes@flatsurface.com>
In-Reply-To:  <20110309194241.12226A007E@locke.alientech.net>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1

Oh Sweet Fanny Moses...

How about this, folks purchase the best tires they are willing to buy and/or afford...

To be honest, I really don't understand why folks have to argue about tires...if one doesn't agree with Ron or anyone else, fine...but this back and forth gets tiresome...(<----yeah, I think I'm funny)

Have a nice day...

Jim Wilmington, NC

On Wed, Mar 9, 2011 at 2:42 PM, Mike S <mikes@flatsurface.com> wrote:

> At 11:52 AM 3/9/2011, The Bus Depot wrote... > >> > Maximum load != normal load. Do you always drive your Vanagon >> > loaded to full weight capacity? The regulations certainly >> > don't expect that to be the case, and that's not what they apply >> to. >> >> Exactly. What the D.O.T. is saying is that there should be a safety >> margin - >> that "maximum load" means just that, maximum, not typical. They are >> saying >> that while the vehicle can be driven periodically with the maximum >> load that >> the tire can handle (if it is an LT rated tire - otherwise 9% below), >> on an >> ongoing basis its NORMAL load should be at least 6% BELOW the tire's >> rated >> capacity. >> > > Or derated capacity, in the case of a passenger car tire. So, you take > a Load Index 97 passenger car tire, which is rated for a maximum load > of 1609 lbs. Divide by 1.10 and you get a rating of 1463 lbs when used > on a Vanagon. That's suitable for a normal, non-Synchro, Vanagon, > including Westys, which have a rear GAWR of 2866. > > The regs say the "normal load" has to be 6% under the tire rating (2 x > 1463 = 2926). The regs also define "normal load" to include a single > 150 lb passenger in the rear. > > It's been previously reported here that the actual rear axle weight of > a standard Westy is ~1920 lbs ( > > http://gerry.vanagon.com/cgi-bin/wa.exe?A2=ind0110C&L=vanagon&P=R9822&m=164259 > ). Add 150 for the "normal load" occupant, and you're at 2070, a full > 29% below maximum capacity. Some other places say a Westy can weigh as > much as 2420 lbs in the rear, which with a 150 lb passenger still puts > you more than 10% under the maximum rated load. The 6% simply doesn't > apply on a Vanagon, ever. > > Additionally, the maximum capacity rating for P-Metric tires is > standardized to an inflation pressure of 35 psi. VW never spec'd an > inflation pressure that low for the rear (minimum was 40), and higher > pressures = more load capacity, which only increases the margin. > > Finally, in the final years of the Vanagon, the OE tires were, guess > what, 205/70R14 97R. Your "you need 99's" contradicts what VW actually > used. > > Bear in mind that VW Campers were sold by Volkswagen as "unfinished >> vehicles" and the GWVR is based on that designation. That is why a >> Westy and >> a Non-Westy have the same rated GWVR. So a Westy will NEVER operate >> at >> "normal load" - rather, it approaches "fully laden" at all times. >> > > All the Westy owners will be disappointed to hear they can't carry much > more than a couple of sleeping bags and pillows, since they start out > "fully laden." Unless by "fully laden" you mean 1000 lbs below the GVWR > (not "GWVR"), which is reality. > > GVWR is the same because they're the same vehicle, with the same > suspension components. Finished or unfinished has nothing to do with > it. You simply can't load as much additional weight into a Westy, > because there's more weight in it to start with. But again, based on > actual measurements, there's still ~900 lbs you can load in the rear of > a Westy and be within spec. > > Since you're still arguing that this additional 6% derating is > required, why does your website say Load Index 99 is sufficient? A > Synchro would need Load Index 103 tires. >


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