Date: Wed, 15 Jun 2011 13:13:35 -0700
Reply-To: Steven P Smith <kewsps@HOTMAIL.COM>
Sender: Vanagon Mailing List <vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com>
From: Steven P Smith <kewsps@HOTMAIL.COM>
Subject: Re: The Dreaded Emissions test
In-Reply-To: <BANLkTi=z4UOZVVTC10c1HBZ5sk4NwnAnow@mail.gmail.com>
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The CA legislature has devolved into doing nothing more than state sectioned
bullying of the many for the benefit of the few. Democracies always end this
way, so it's OK. Perhaps the people should be revolting.
Steven
-----Original Message-----
From: Roland
Sent: Wednesday, June 15, 2011 12:48 PM
To: vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM
Subject: Re: The Dreaded Emissions test
At the risk of invoking some feedback about insufficient ethical and
righteous behaviors on my part :).
I'll stick my neck out and mention that my Vanagon passed smog with the
non-California version of the Cat. For example:
http://www.van-cafe.com/home/van/smartlist_1192/catalytic_converter.html
which is only $145 vs the other one at $325. At the time about a year and
half ago the lowest cost Cali Cat that I could find was about $450. It just
didn't make sense to please the "questionable" beaurocrats for that much
more money vs simply make sure that my Vanagon passed the smog test.
Roland
On Wed, Jun 15, 2011 at 3:19 AM, Dennis Haynes
<d23haynes57@hotmail.com>wrote:
> Those numbers would have destroyed a healthy Cat so yes you should plan to
> replace it. The O2 sensor working properly should be adjusting the CO to
> ~.5% and a working Cat should bring it to near 0. Be sure the ignition
> timing is set right and avoid the temptation to over advance it. This can
> make HC and CO read high at idle. Idle speed should be 850-950 rpm.
>
> Dennis
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Vanagon Mailing List [mailto:vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com] On Behalf Of
> Ken Wyatt
> Sent: Tuesday, June 14, 2011 11:45 PM
> To: vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM
> Subject: Re: The Dreaded Emissions test
>
> After a day of messing around with timing. mixture and idle rpms and such
> we're still borderline compliance. O2 sensor is checing out so we are
> leaning towards the catalytic converter being the culprit.
> I'll have to check on the Compression and leak down as I don't have that
> data.
>
> Kw
> 82 westy
>
> On Sun, Jun 12, 2011 at 9:02 PM, Dennis Haynes <d23haynes57@hotmail.com>
> wrote:
> > NOx emissions are the result of heat, pressure, and excess O2. As such
> > testing requires the engine to be loaded. That is why some areas use
> > the dyno as this is the only way to test for NOx emissions. Now for CO
> > and HC here is some diagnostic information.
> >
> > CO (carbon monoxide) is the result of incomplete combustion due to O2
> > not being combining with the fuel, usually caused by a rich mixture or
> > poor vaporization and mixing.
> >
> > Excessive HC (hydrocarbons) is the result of fuel that never got
> > ignited or escaped before the burn was complete. Although with good
> > ignition and mixture the burn should finish in the catalytic converter
> > or exhaust. This is why many cars have air pumps or other means to get
> air
> into the exhaust.
> > The usual causes of high HC are "lean Misfire", bad valves, pistons,
> > ignition miss, or ignition timing way off.
> >
> > If your van does not have an O2 sensor for final control you should be
> > adjusted somewhere near 1% pre cat at idle.
> >
> > With the engine being fairly new I have to ask if it was tested as
> > part of the installation? Has the engine operation changed at all?
> > Maybe it wasn't right from the get go. The high idle is a sign things
> > were not set up correctly.
> >
> > As part of the trouble shooting process and to make sure the engine is
> > good you need to get a compression and leak down test performed. These
> > engines are known for valve and head seal issues. The heads not
> > sealing to the cylinders are often the result of the cases being worn or
> distorted.
> >
> > Dennis
> >
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Vanagon Mailing List [mailto:vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com] On
> > Behalf Of Ken Wyatt
> > Sent: Sunday, June 12, 2011 12:26 PM
> > To: vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM
> > Subject: Re: The Dreaded Emissions test
> >
> > Opps sorry I somehow deleted the results of the second test on a very
> > warm engine. It still failed after freeway driving. HC was still
> > over the max of 220 at 437 PPM versus 469 PPM cold. CO was 2.83% cold
> > and 1.577% warm. The CO2 on the first test was 12.94% and O2% was
> > 1.46% at 2500 RPM. At Idle it was CO2 at 11.37% and O2 at 2.07 %. It
> > appears we don't check NOx anymore here in Salt Lake.
> >
> > I had always heard that the older VW aircooled engines were designed
> > to run slightly rich to enhance engine cooling. Anyone care to
> > comment on that. My mechanic is an old VW guy from way back and I
> > feel he knows the engines. He completely built it last year with new
> > heads and all. So i am having him take the first look at it this week
> > while I'm working, hoping its just a small adjustment. Will report
> > back.
> >
> > Cheers,
> > Ken Wyatt
> > 82 westy
> > Thinking of mounting my 1976 Lincoln Continental Mark IV's large
> > chrome grill onto my 82 Westy, as soon as I add a radiator for the
> > 460. It fits the front vanagon contours well.
> >
> > On Fri, Jun 10, 2011 at 12:42 PM, Ken Wyatt <57skibum@gmail.com> wrote:
> >> Howdy vanagonauts, I'm having trouble getting my 1982 westy to pass
> >> Utah emissions. Scary thing is that it has a new (3000 miles)
> >> aircooled 2.0 l FI engine. I thought it would be no problem to pass.
> >> But NOT!! I'm failing on the idle HC and CO.
> >>
> >> Last Friday for the first try, the mechanic tested the engine cold
> >> and got HC at 469 (passing is 220 or less), and 2.83 on CO (passing
> >> is 1.2% or less) The higher 2500 RPM test resulted in HC 203 and CO
> >> at
> >> 0.979 % which was passing just barely passing there.
> >>
> >> I figured that it was just the cold engine. So today I drove it
> >> until it was completely at operating temp quick thoughts on where to
> >> start or what to check? The engine sounds perfectly VW to me. The
> >> idle is running about 1100 and I'm wondering if that's slightly high.
> >>
> >> It sure would be nice to go camping but no registration..............
> >> No
> > fun!!
> >> Ken Wyatt
> >> 82 westy
> >>
> >
> >
>
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