Date: Sun, 26 Jun 2011 23:46:26 -0700
Reply-To: Scott Daniel - Turbovans <scottdaniel@TURBOVANS.COM>
Sender: Vanagon Mailing List <vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com>
From: Scott Daniel - Turbovans <scottdaniel@TURBOVANS.COM>
Subject: Re: Vibration when radiator fan on high speed
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1";
reply-type=original
Hi David Wolfsburg ...
I love my 87 Wofsburg !
a total 'sports car' of a vanagon. ( not with 14 inch wheels especially
though ) ..
well...
when I did foreign car repair day in and day out ..
there would be people that would call and cry that they couldn't get their
car to me..
and beg me to pick them up ..
all kinds of stuff like that.
They don't have a freind that can drive them ?
a taxi can be expensive..
but 5 or 6 miles ?
some people run that in 40 minutes. ..
But stops in Arizone don't have a simple sun shade roof ?
that's bizzare.
maybe there's a vanagon buddy where you live and you can help each other get
your vans in for repairs.
really though..
I've had people insist that they could not get their car to me...
and that was in a well populated area full of rich people too ..
not saying you are ....but some of them just could not get that it was their
job to get their car to the repair shop..
and ..
heck I have a friend that won't ask for anything ..and I keep telling her..
you give your friends a chance to serve you when you let them know of
something they can do that you need .. it's a win-win. It's empowering
both ways even.
and you can drive them somewhere someday.
People don't have any trouble getting their vanagons to me...
I get them in from Nevada, from California..
an engine driven down from Seattle .
These days I do more 'big project work', not 'repair and service.' so much,
though I do that too.
and ....really ....with the age of vanagons now ..it is NEVER just that a
tired part needs to be replaced..
it's that 15 things need to be addressed. I get vans in for one thing...it
commonly turns into 12 things, and I'm not overselling or anything like
that. I am just idetifying the very worn out, loose, rusted, or whatever
falling off parts that so many vanagons suffer from. I even ask people 'are
you sure you want me to tell you about all the things I find worn out or
wrong or not working on your van ???"
and really ..
day in and day out 'foreign car repair' with the shop only working daytine
hours 5 days a week..
and those guys trying get out of there at 5 or 6 o'clock with all jobs fixed
and done right, and on time..
that is Horribly Streesful ..
I am so glad I don't do that anymore.
and ..the more speicialized a shop you find..
they better they will be at *everything* assoicated with working on your
type of car.
Tehre amy not be enough vanagons in your area to support a typical medium
size shop with employees though...doing mainly vanagons only. That's not
even practical for most shops.
but you find one that really is into them ..
and they know all the tricks and weak areas etc.
as for 'where a shop is' ..
5 or 6 miles is 'right over there' ..
and bus systems ..
a terrible way to get around.
'the car' used apppropiately is a fantastic invention.
I don't even feel safe on a public bus.
find a friend to help you with schelping the van to the shop for a start.
That will help a lot.
some of my sayings..
'Fixing a vanagon when it breaks is a horrible way to take care of it.'
now maybe ..
taking a vanagon to a regular car shop, no matter how fancy or expensive ..
is not a very good way to take care of it.
'shops' are really just 'parts repalcers' and they do 'standard jobs' ..like
cluth or brakes.
They don't even have time to really do all the little details these special
vehicles need.
I spend at least as much time treating rust and neglected things as I do
fixing common broken or worn out things.
And I have seen a local somewhat fancy shop spend 800 hundred dollars of
someone's money on their Vanagon ..on things they didn't even need that much
..
and not even notice or catch that 5 of the 6 rear running lights were out
!!!!
I mean really ..
if you are smart ..and you are looking for work that a vehicle may need, and
you care about doing a good job for people ...and their safety ..
wouldn't you at least check their exterior running lights for them when the
van is in for a significant amount of work !?? ( not in this car repair
culture evidently ) .
how hard is that !!
jeez. That is ALL TOO COMMON for what passes for 'car repair' in this
culture. Uusally you are not getting much really.
don't get me started- I have seen a Cadilac get worked on to the tune of
hundreds of dollars with a squeaky driver's door and no one could take a
second to give it a shot of lube ..I had to get the service writers to do it
for my friend's cadilac.
that's what you can commonly get in regular shops. It's pathetic. No
concept whatsoever of what 'service' is .......I mean like a nun is in
service to god..that kind of 'service' . It's not even in ameican
consciousness very much. Certainly not much in the auto world.
Really ..what they do is 'look for JUSTIFIABLE PROFITABLE repairs. '
that's what the do.
if they can mostly honestly say your front end needs $ 900 ...that's what
they'll tell you ..
and then do the job in 4 hours max. At very high profit. And maybe
something you didn't really, really need that much.
these days I tell them ( like tire mounting people ) I am willing to pay
Extra to have it done right and carefully.
good luck on your Vanagon repairs !
I can even tell people what they have not done ..
I could 'just tell' a guy didn't fill his coolant license plate after
remounting it today.
I just knew it.
I 'knew' a guy on the list stroked the brake pedal all the way to the floor,
on a used brake master cylinder...and that's why he had mushy brakes. I
could just tell that from here.
I 'just knew' a guy working for me did not test the heater/defroster after
changing the coolant on a vanagon, a long time ago.
anyway ...bad car work is pretty common. Sad to say.
( I'll write about the driver's mental connection with the engine and how
it's running one of these days.
I drive many vans and I hoped into one the other day ..
I forgot for a minute if I was in a diesel or gas vanagon
and realized ...the mental connection I have with the inner workings of the
engine and fuel system and everything wasn't quite 'on' ...as soon as I
realized which van and engine I was driving..
my mind was right in there with the injectors spraying, the distrbutor
making igntion etc.
If you develope that with your vanagon ..it's a whole other world. ..
far different from conductiing it down the road and watching to see if it
does the right things. - almost like you are 'making' it do the right
things. )
what fun !
if anyone read this far, sorry it got so long !
scott
www.turbovans.com
----- Original Message -----
From: "David Vickery" <david_vickery@YAHOO.COM>
To: <vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM>
Sent: Sunday, June 26, 2011 9:31 AM
Subject: Re: Vibration when radiator fan on high speed
What Scott said. The shop I go to is excellent and they stop you from
trying to do too much at once. They realize it is inefficient, and I have
found it more expensive when I have insisted on a few things at once. I
think I am paying for more down time.
And maybe find another shop. The closest doesn't mean the best. Filling a
AC system with R12 doesn't sound like the right way to test for leaks.
Stripping a drain plug could also be a warning flag unless it wasn't their
fault.
Figure out a better way to get your van serviced. Stick a bike in the van
and get some exercise riding home, or a moped. Or get a lift, or find a
shop that has a loaner car. Finding an excellent shop is job 1 for a
vanagon owner.
--- On Sun, 6/26/11, David M <covrambles@YAHOO.COM> wrote:
> From: David M <covrambles@YAHOO.COM>
> Subject: Re: Vibration when radiator fan on high speed
> To: vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM
> Date: Sunday, June 26, 2011, 1:46 AM
> What you are saying makes sense,
> but...
> I had multiple things worked on at once because it is an
> extremely complicated and inconvenient for me to take my van
> to the (nearest) repair shop that knows anything about
> Vanagons. I live about 5-6 miles or so from the shop. To get
> there I drive my van, to get back I have to walk 1/2 mile in
> 110 degree heat, then wait for a bus that runs only every
> 1/2 hour. I take 2 separate buses (about an hour) , then
> walk another 1/2 mile back home. Picking up the van is the
> reverse, two 1/2 mile walks, 2 buses about an hour to an
> hour and a half traveling and waiting times. Most bus stops
> have no shade from the Arizona sun. The shop had my van from
> Monday AM to Friday AM, four full days.
>
> -David ('87 Wolfsburg)
>
>
> --- On Fri, 6/24/11, Scott Daniel - Turbovans <scottdaniel@turbovans.com>
> wrote:
>
> From: Scott Daniel - Turbovans <scottdaniel@turbovans.com>
> Subject: Re: Vibration when radiator
> fan on high speed
> To: "David M" <covrambles@YAHOO.COM>,
> vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM
> Date: Friday, June 24, 2011, 6:49 PM.
>
> I would, sincerely, be careful about doing to many repairs
> or changes at once.
> If it had been just the AC...
> you could just focus on how that's working and if high on
> the rad fan is right..
> ( many cars are wired so when AC comressor clutch is
> engaged, rad fan comes on ..
> though not on 'full roar' that I am aware of. )
>
> so they worked on 4 main areas..
> AC
> emissions and oil change,
> shift linkage,
> and gas tank.
>
> It's likely you would have better results if you didn't ask
> them to do those four areas all at once.
>
> besides, in a regular car repair shop ...
> there isn't time to do it carefully and really truly
> right.
> You increase the odds of successs by not asking them to
> take on too many repairs or tasks in one visit.
>
> if the goal on 'emissions' was to get within spec, and
> change the oil..
> that by itself would have been one thing to tackle in one
> shop visit.
>
> now you have at least two problems.. i.e. it's not
> really done.
> Fan on 'full roar' may not be right ..
> and it doesn't go for beans when you tell it too.
>
> they will even have to do a lot of explaining, or work on
> it some more. ..
> or you'll have to take what you have right now ..
> which doesn't sound satisfactory.
>
> I'm serious too ..
> having worked 'in the trenches' countless thousands of days
> on 'regular ole foreign car repair ' ..
> it's not fun when there are issues to deal with on a car
> from one end to the other. It's just more streesful than
> it is anyway .........like to have it done right by 5
> o'clock ...
> that's insanely hard as it is, never mind numerous issues
> to deal with all at once.
> It dilutes their focus.
>
> keep it simple for them .....'what ah'm sayin.'
> and it increases the odds for success .
>
> scott
> www.turbovans.com
>
>
>
>
> ----- Original Message ----- From: "David M" <covrambles@YAHOO.COM>
> To: <vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM>
> Sent: Friday, June 24, 2011 4:33 PM
> Subject: Vibration when radiator fan on high speed
>
>
> Just paid $1200 to have my van worked on (a/c fixed, fuel
> tank resealed, gearshift linkage, oil change, emissions).
> Mechanic said fan should be on high-speed whenever a/c is
> on, is this true?
> Now I notice a really bad vibration (can feel it thru
> pedals) when a/c fan is on high.
> Could this vibration have to do with fuel tank being
> dropped and re-installed?
> I dont know if fan was ever on high before but I never
> noticed this vibration back when the a/c worked before (10
> years ago).
> Also van now has no pick-up whatsoever, I press the gas
> pedal and it takes forever for me to take off.
> Regarding a/c all mechanic did was fill it with freon R12
> (3 1/2 pounds cost $262.50).
> It was $400 in labor to do the gas tank with me supplying
> the kit of parts.
> The oil change cost me $106.50 because the drain plug
> stripped and labor to install a helicoil was $80.
> I have to take van back on Tuesday for them to check if any
> of the valuable freon has leaked out.
> Its so frustrating that whenever I take my van in to be
> worked on., it always comes back with the original problem
> fixed but with a new set of problems appearing!
>
> -David (1987 Wolfsburg)
>
