Date: Thu, 7 Feb 2013 12:40:20 -0800
Reply-To: neil n <musomuso@GMAIL.COM>
Sender: Vanagon Mailing List <vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com>
From: neil n <musomuso@GMAIL.COM>
Subject: Re: No Start Cause: Relay Failure. PICS, Thoughts.
In-Reply-To: <5112E6E3.1000001@turbovans.com>
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On Wed, Feb 6, 2013 at 3:27 PM, Scott Daniel - Turbovans
<scottdaniel@turbovans.com> wrote:
> so far I am not sure that's a diode in there.
I agree. I used my volt-ohm meter to measure at 85 and 86 of an 18,
53, 167, and generic 40 Amp 87-87a relay. I saw an average of 60 Ohms,
meter set to 200 Ohm scale. I guess since the resistor and coil are in
parallel, the coil doesn't add resistance.
> Page 97.5 of the Green Vanagon Bentley manual shows..
> the first item even, at the upper left of the page ..a little can like that
> is a resistor,
> which makes perfect sense to me inside that relay parallel to the energizing
> coil.
I'll check that out!
> I can't help being somewhat of an artist about engine conversions..
> how things lay and look ....how neat they are ..
> and with a lot of attention to making it reliable ( really .....stock
> factory installations are mostly really well done in the automotive world,
> generally speaking . but not jetta fuse boxes IMO , more or less )
I suspect my next swap will be perfect! Ha ha. I see what you mean
Scott. i.e some have knack for imagining wiring harness layout. I am
learning more of that aspect. In your case I'm sure it's not just the
innate sense you have for these things, but years of experience. This
is HUGE.
I considered installing the OEM Jetta fuse box on this swap. In
hindsight, not a bad idea, but it's a bulky thing for a couple of
fuses and 3 relays.
A big part of what I'm realizing, in hindsight, is that I had a lot on
my plate doing this swap.
I was warned though. ;^)
Thoughts and questions like "is the relay box too close to the
exhaust?" were rampant in my mind; I was trying to "see" and sort out
WAY too many details more or less all at once. i.e. When I first
"finished" my swap, I had all the wires wrapped, covered in corrugated
cover, and tied down. All was fine. Short story version: things like
wiring position got changed several times over the years while this
swap was running.
picture of original wire routing etc. Arrow points to old location of
relay box and some wires:
https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-zPfjkyKLwGw/URQNJH5wgqI/AAAAAAAAG1Q/E7M3OhPV8g8/s752/Engine%2520In%2520Runs2%2520Use%2520.jpg
Even now, looking at that, I still see things that should be improved
(and have been)
> I'm just surprised at how people 'make stuff up
> ..... relays rolling around loose
> under the back seat ..
> reminds me of the old saying ..'if it's worth doing, it's worth doing
> right.'
Yup. Lesson learned. OTOH, I did take time to house and wire the
relays best I could. But I see your point. Some people claim to have
done a pro job but really its junk and possibly dangerous.
> do you scrounge around junkyards ?
No. Local yards are really overpriced. I can't abide by that kind of
thing. Then again, I should get in the habit of viewing other
vehicles. Thinking now, taking pictures would help. Get ideas.
> heck ...another of my rules...when you find a 'fitter' you gotta use it.
> The vanagon main and fp relay setup is a perfect 'fitter' ..just begging to
> be used just like it is.
>
> all the careful fitting and engineering is already done for ya there.
Doing this swap gave (is giving) me a real appreciation of the R&D put
into a given part.
I posted images of what suppression part is used on common relays to
help shed some light. Yes, in my case, the WBX relays would be
preferable; they have standard size connectors. I'm not sure why the
Jetta fuel pump relay has two "giant" connectors.
I should measure the current draw of the Vanagon fuel pump and Jetta
HO2S in my swap. All of that is on 1 circuit, as per Jetta OEM. Maybe
a WBX fuel pump relay would be perfectly fine for that.
Neil.
--
Neil n
65 kb image Myford Ready For Assembly http://tinyurl.com/64sx4rp
'88 Slate Blue Westy to be named.
'81 VanaJetta 2.0 "Jaco" http://tubaneil.googlepages.com/
Vanagon VAG Gas I4/VR Swap Google Group:
http://groups.google.com/group/vanagons-with-vw-inline-4-cylinder-gas-engines
