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Date:         Thu, 7 Feb 2013 13:10:13 -0800
Reply-To:     neil n <musomuso@GMAIL.COM>
Sender:       Vanagon Mailing List <vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com>
From:         neil n <musomuso@GMAIL.COM>
Subject:      Re: No Start Cause: Relay Failure. PICS, Thoughts.
Comments: To: David Beierl <dbeierl@attglobal.net>
In-Reply-To:  <51134a28.a6b3340a.2b3a.ffffa18eSMTPIN_ADDED_MISSING@mx.google.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1

On Wed, Feb 6, 2013 at 10:30 PM, David Beierl <dbeierl@attglobal.net> wrote: > At 05:19 PM 2/6/2013, neil n wrote:

>> https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-8GS0_Zk_uJE/UQRc-4jPHLI/AAAAAAAAGtA/jibwhoITrAU/s800/power%2520supply%2520relay.jpg > > > Ok. They had a relay socket meant to be used with a relay driven from the > positive side, and an ECU with open-collector (a transistor with emitter to > ground, collector facing the outside world) switching. It was worth it to > them to build a special relay with the relay 85 pin going to the socket 86 > pin (being used as an 85 circuit from the ECU).

Ah ok. Helpful to know. I can see that from a $ point of view.

>> >> https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-vrLtjwmz4xI/URLRueP8Q9I/AAAAAAAAGzg/Jh2bqF0A6jE/s720/109%2520relay%2520contact%2520close%2520up.jpg > > > The part you need to see is in between the contact faces, not visible in the > photo. Incidentally, is that a NC contact on top, or just a plate for the > moving contact to bounce against?

The image shows the relay unpowered. With the switch in that position, I just now measured for continuity between that "plate" and various points. The switch contact must be marginal, as the Ohms jump around on my DMM, but at times it shows continuity from that "plate" connects to one side of the resistor and pin 85. (which connects to supplied ground from ECU)

>> Not sure if VW wanted to save money on wire, > > If you know you're going to be switching from the ground side and the coil > is the same voltage as the supply, makes things simpler/cheaper to use a > quarter inch of wire inside instead of n inches and a terminal outside. > Since you're using huge volumes of them the setup cost for the relay doesn't > add much.

Right. Makes sen$e.

>> The fuel pump relay is similar. Diagram image: >> (ignore my annotations): >> >> >> https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-qjVqWgmKgiA/UQLzz0KnCHI/AAAAAAAAGq8/dV79PgDqWQg/s720/ABA%2520swap%2520coil%2520wire%253F.jpg >

>.... Re the annotations, I presume there's an 85 circuit there > somewhere, 'cause the relay as drawn won't work unless they/you are > connecting 85 internally to the load, which is *really* cheating.

Ha ha. No. Even I wouldn't try that. The plan was to supply a constant ground with 15 from ignition switch supply + to energize relay.

-- Neil n

65 kb image Myford Ready For Assembly http://tinyurl.com/64sx4rp

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