Date: Sat, 27 Jul 2013 14:56:51 -0400
Reply-To: "kenneth wilford (Van-Again)" <kenwilfy@COMCAST.NET>
Sender: Vanagon Mailing List <vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com>
From: "kenneth wilford (Van-Again)" <kenwilfy@COMCAST.NET>
Subject: Re: adding a new dash A/C unit?
In-Reply-To: <51F33811.9050107@cox.net>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
Mark,
I have been dealing with Vanagon AC systems for years and years. I have
also installed two aftermarket systems with varying results. The first
system I installed was made by a company in Florida which is Gillmore
Enterprises if I remember correctly. http://www.gilmore-enterprises.net/
This system went into a 67 VW Bus and it actually worked great! It used a
new compressor that only took 1hp off of the engine, and it mounted the
evaporator under the bus. I set this system up without too much hassle and
as far as I know it is still working down in the Caribbean today.
The second one we did was in a Vanagon with a Subaru conversion.
http://www.europeancoolerair.com/cooler.htm It was a split system with
front and rear AC units. The customer had already bought it and spent a
bunch of money on the system before I even entered the picture. We were to
install it into a 90 Westy with the Subaru conversion (already installed).
It was a Canadian Westy so it had never had AC before. The manufacturer
told the customer when he sold it that install would take 10 hours.
The quality level was just fair. The system used a small evaporator in the
front that mounted above the glove box. This unit put out cold air but the
biggest problem we had with it was the fan. It would grind against the
housing unless you had it at the perfect angle. Since you are driving down
the road, hitting bumps, and turning, this "perfect angle" was almost
always not there and it would make noise and grind more than not. When I
called the kit maker he knew about the problem and gave me some vague
instructions on how to "fix" it. Really it was a design flaw so unless I
got to redesign the front evap housing, the problem was never going to go
away.
The rear evaporator was huge and also put out a lot of cold air. However
the problem back here was that the housing was so big that it not only
filled the entire rear cabinet but there was no room for the rear speakers
in the cabinet to live there any longer. Again, another design flaw in the
housing which was not mentioned at all in the instructions, but was well
known by the kit builder. We modified the housing to allow for the
speakers, but I never really got as good air flow out of the rear housing
as I would have liked. It didn't use the large diffuser that the late
model Westies used, instead being more like the earlier stock Westy
versions with just generic car vents.
The amount of time to do the install on this kit was over 30 hours! You
heard me right, 30 hours! The customer was upset when I told him it was
going to be 20 hours (before we were done) and insisted that the kit
manufacturer said that it would only take 10 hours for a "skilled" mechanic
to install the kit. I am very skilled, I have been doing conversion type
work on Vanagons for almost 15 years now. Not sure how much more skill you
are going to need but I wanted this install so that it worked great and
looked stock. My Dad is a professional carpenter and he helped me modify
the rear cabinet and the van body to allow for the wiring, the hoses, and
installing the evaporators. All of these mods take time to do right and
look good when you are finished. The kit maker encouraged me to take short
cuts just to get it done in the 10 hours. So if you are going to do this
job, I think it would be better to do it yourself. Paying someone to do it
would either be really expensive or that person would take a loss on it and
probably not want to see you pull into his shop again.
When it was all said and done, it worked decent, however since I had over
10 hours of extra labor that I wasn't going to get paid for, it didn't work
well enough to really make me happy. The customer didn't like the fact
that the front evaporator fan made noise randomly, didn't get ice cold,
etc. So neither of us were really happy with it once it was done, and I am
not really looking forward to doing another one. I would never install one
of those crappy front evaporator housings again and since that is what
makes the whole thing unique, I would probably not want to do this again.
I looked to Blake's page and his AC evaporator/heater unit is different as
it replaces the center heater box and the one we did installed to the
passenger side of it. Maybe if I were going to attempt this again I would
try that unit. But I am not as anxious to try as I once was.
Hope this helps you out.
Ken Wilford
John 3:16
www.vanagain.com
On Fri, Jul 26, 2013 at 11:01 PM, mark drillock <mdrillock@cox.net> wrote:
> SmallCar's description says:
>
> "The air is recycled interior air so the A/C is most effective. Outside
> air can be introduced with the windows if desired."
>
> As for size, I am really only concerned with cooling the people in the 2
> front seats, with priority given to cooling the passenger seat area. I
> have found a unit that will fit inside the dash in the large open space
> hidden above the glovebox. It does not intrude on the glovebox space
> itself. It has the vents right on it's face, with the controls to the
> left of them so driver and pass can both reach them. It will require a
> large rectangle cut into the dash face for it to protrude through. I
> don't want the A/C cooled air to be outside air, I just want outside air
> to be available the rest of the time through the stock vent system, not
> only through the windows. It is 14,000 btu and 300 CFM. It looks like
> the retail parts cost for the whole new system would be about $800, dash
> unit, compressor, fittings, hoses, condenser, dryer, etc. I may decide
> to spend $600 more on the special tools to make my own hoses from the
> parts since I will want to duplicate the effort on several vans.
>
> Mark
>
> Dennis Haynes wrote:
>
>> .....
>>
>> Bring money! The Small car set up is based on one of these solutions. What
>> their solution does offer is the ability to bring fresh air in and
>> condition
>> it when needed with heat or cooling. Actually with the blend system you
>> can
>> use some of both to also reduce humidity just like most modern cars. When
>> looking at these choices you do need to consider capacity. Some are only 1
>> ton, (12,000 btu.) which is not adequate for a Vanagon especially when
>> bring
>> in outside air.
>>
>> Dennis
>>
>>
--
Thanks,
Ken Wilford
John 3:16
www.vanagain.com
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