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Date:         Sat, 14 Sep 2013 19:31:29 -0400
Reply-To:     Larry Alofs <lalofs@GMAIL.COM>
Sender:       Vanagon Mailing List <vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com>
From:         Larry Alofs <lalofs@GMAIL.COM>
Subject:      Re: Why Bigger Brakes Was Cause of brake rotor warping
Comments: To: Scott Daniel <scottdaniel@turbovans.com>
In-Reply-To:  <5234CA28.1020204@turbovans.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1

ABS isn't very "super modern high tech" anymore

Larry A.

On Sat, Sep 14, 2013 at 4:42 PM, Scott Daniel <scottdaniel@turbovans.com>wrote:

> Hi Dave ... > obviously .....one doesn't waituntil loss of control of descent speed is > starting to happen. > I think you live in an area that does not have a lot of long or steep > descents. > Those two mentioned the other day are classic descents on the West > coast (where there are many long chalelening descents' ) > > as soon as one starts into one of those ..if thinking and at all a > skilled driver ..you go right into 'long steep descent mode' .. > you keep speed down, you downshift etc. > > done right ...there's never any feel of brake fade. > Heck ..if someone ever feels brake fade affect at all, they've already > over-driven the brakes. > If that does happen ..you immeidately go into 'even slower more careful > mode' . > > 'usually' when a truck can't control their descent speed ...they may > have never built up much real speed. > a say 60,000 lb truck can be going 7 mph and not be able to stop. Even > slowerthat that sometimes. > So probably, most of thetime trucks don't fly into those gravel traps > at say 60+. > I think I have seen just one ever in a gravel trap .. > and I doubt they entered going very fast at all. > > there is a LOT one can do that's intelligent when braking any vehicle. > It's not just 'pushing on that pedaland seeing what happens.' > > Develope a feel for it. Use your brakes all kinds of ways that you > wouldn't usually in safe places. > People should have an idea what their van is going to do in a panic stop > situation at say 70 mph. > Of course people should never 'drive into' situations > where there's going to be any panic stop situation. > Manypeople do though ...'most drivers' are fairly clueless. > not montioring what's going on behind them and way behind them.. > or WAY out in front of them .. > they let people fly formation on them, follow too close .. > drive alongside buses and trucks for miles at a time.. > and many other dumb things .. > and.. > heck ..even in a panic stop ..it is not 'cream on the brake pedal full > instaneous effort' . > that's good way to loose control of the vehicle. > Even in a 'oh crap !!' panic stop ...use 'feel' ....you want the tires ( > on dry pavement ) just short of lock-up. > > if fact ...super modern high tech cars like BMW's and Mercedes can tell > when the driver has freaked out and is in full panic stop mode, and will > operate the breaks appropriately and much better than a paniced typical > clueless driver can. > > Electro-hydrualic brakes ..all computer controlled, can do things like > drag the pads very lightly on the discs in rainy conditions..to keeep > the pads dry. > Modern cars have 'electronic brake force distribution' .. > the sensors and computers in the cars are working hard to get the > absolute most out of the brakes. > Heck ....some exotic cars have carbon ceramic brakes that are an 8,000+ > dollar option. > Those don't fade, period. > > Just drive smart is all ! Drive within the capabilities of the > vehicle and stay 'AWAY' from other cars as much as possible - you'd > think people would realize this, but they don't. One gender I am sure > feels better closer to other cars ...like that's more trusting and > intimate driving that way ... ...something that we are not allowed to > say ..but it's an actual factor. > I've had someone 'lock on' to me at night .. > on totally empty roads ..over and over ...just could not shake 'em .. > whether I sped up or slowed down ...every 10 minutes or so ..there'd > they be ..'locked on' again ..close to me, on a totally empty deserted > road. Sure enough ..it wasn't a man. > try to drive AWAY from other vehicles please ! It can onlyhelp. Dense > traffic is a differen story of course. > And even then people don't see how to 'control and defend their > position' intelligently in the whole mass. > > besafe ! > > > > > On 9/14/2013 6:42 AM, Dave Mcneely wrote: > >> Well Scott, what does one do if the brakes are overheated, but not using >> them will result in uncontrollable speed? I have never had this situation, >> though I have driven on some several mile long, steep grades. But some >> people have. Truckers certainly have faced that situation, to the point >> that highways are equipped with runaway truck ramps. I can sure imagine >> the fear involved in having to pull into one of those things! mcneely >> >> ---- Scott Daniel <scottdaniel@turbovans.com> wrote: >> >>> I hope everyone recognizes it's better to cool brakes by driving and not >>> using them, then to just stop with very hot brakes. >>> >>> >>> On 9/13/2013 8:29 PM, Dave Mcneely wrote: >>> >>>> ---- Mike Miller <mwmiller6@ATT.NET> wrote: >>>> >>>>> I certainly didn't do it on purpose. In both cases when it happened I >>>>> just didn't think it would, but there was never a place to get off the >>>>> brakes and let them cool. Constant downgrade and suddenly overheated! >>>>> >>>> What gear were you in? Was there a place to stop? Maybe not, on some >>>> mountain roads there is no place to pull over. But in a low gear one is >>>> usually able to keep the speed down enough to rest the brakes sometimes. >>>> >>>>> On Sep 13, 2013, at 3:54 PM, <mcneely4@cox.net> wrote: >>>>> >>>>> ---- Mike Miller <mwmiller6@ATT.NET> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>>> Haven't had to gear down yet, but I haven't gone over those two >>>>>>> roads again either >>>>>>> >>>>>> I don't have to be on brutally downhill roads to gear down and avoid >>>>>> excessive braking. I have never overheated brakes, and I don't intend to. >>>>>> mcneely >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> ______________________________**__ >>>>>> >>>>> -- >>>> David McNeely >>>> >>>> -- >> David McNeely >> >>


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