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Date:         Thu, 24 Oct 2013 13:31:00 -0700
Reply-To:     Scott Daniel <scottdaniel@TURBOVANS.COM>
Sender:       Vanagon Mailing List <vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com>
From:         Scott Daniel <scottdaniel@TURBOVANS.COM>
Organization: Cosmic Reminders
Subject:      Re: off with her heads
Comments: To: Tom Carchrae <tom@CARCHRAE.NET>
In-Reply-To:  <CAFNeVpFsXtyXZbMqktpkeQEKCvn+3URgW+ZJmfNsjMkogTxKFQ@mail.gmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed

HI Angus .. on the 'bar thing'..yeah, Angus turned me onto what you meant. The word you wanted was 'baring' .

On the rings ..I find that compression rings go in fairly easily .. it's the oil rings that are a tight squeeze sometimes.

One way to gauge piston ring and barrel wear is to remove an old ring from that piston, put it in the barrel and measure the end gap of the ring, then compare that to spec.

You'll likely find pretty 'good' wear.

I forget how many miles on your engine .. and it's always .."Do I just fix what's really broken or worn badly ? .. or do I go further ? And ....once you do 'this' ..then might as well do 'that' too .. and it just keeps growing that way.

Need to draw the line somewhere .. it's tempting to do new rings and rod bearings ... but then you might as well do X too ...........etc. etc. etc.

yes, the right forward cylinder is # 1 . VW has used that numbering pattern in their oppossed fours since about 1950, if not before that even.

here's a neat trick .. when you are adjusting your valves, turn the engine backwards to get to each cylinder on compression in turn ... that it's 1, 2, 3 , 4 . Confirm which cylinder you are on by dist rotor position .

If anyone is interested in rebuildable 1.9 core waterboxer engines ....I have about 6 and don't want much for an assembled short block. You can make a 1.9 DH code engine into 2.1 by putting a 2.1 crankshaft in it.

Scott

On 10/24/2013 8:08 AM, Tom Carchrae wrote: > @Scott: > > Thanks for confirming about the valves. I'm not entirely sure which ring > it is, I'll go and have a closer look today. Btw, I didn't adjust anything > with a bar - bar was meant as a synonym for 'except'. I am pretty sure it > is cylinder #1 (it is the closest to the passenger seat). > > > @Dennis; > > > On Wed, Oct 23, 2013 at 10:50 PM, Dennis Haynes <d23haynes57@hotmail.com>wrote: > >> Please take this as training. > > I do take it that way - mistakes are the best teacher, so they say?.... but > still enjoying learning and working on it. > > I also very much appreciative of all the time and insight you, and others, > on the list are so generous with. > > > >> At the point that compression test was taken >> that engine should have been taken out of service and further evaluated. >> All >> the cylinders are down and the one with 60 psi indicates a failure. If you >> had an emissions test program it should have failed. The catalyst is most >> likely shot. More concerning is while that cylinder was down the remaining >> three had to work harder to compensate. > > That is the strange part - it passed the emissions test fine, not even > close to failing. The mechanic who did the compression test also thought > it would be a problem. So, I don't understand how that works, except > perhaps that Vancouver's AirCare is a farce - one that they are ceasing to > operate next year. > > > >> This often translate to increased >> wear on the rod bearings. The oil contamination from unburned fuel doesn't >> help things. Before taking the engine a part a leak down test would help to >> diagnose if you had a valve or a ring problem. >> > This is was my most expensive lesson. I took it to a mechanic, and asked > him to do a leak down test, and to look at the compression problem. He > reported back that he had got the compression back up by adding racing lash > caps. I recall asking him about the leak down, and got back 'fine', and > 'it holds pressure', and so on. It is clear from what you're saying that I > should replace the valve adjusting screws, not just pad them with lash caps. > > Shortly after that, he changed the expansion cap, and I started to get a > really expensive series of coolant explosions. Then I drove the van across > western canada, with a few incidents, although after I changed the pressure > cap to another one I didn't have any more explosions - just coolant backup > behind the plate, and it was fine for an entire leg of the journey home. > Each experience made me want to fix it myself more - the last incident was > taken care of while we stopped for lunch (the first involved a tow truck, > waiting around for a day, and a crappy patch on a hose). > > Anyway, all that is now water under the... no, coolant under the van? har > har. sorry, sorry... groan-worthy. > > > >> Now that the heads are off there are some easy checks you can make. Put the >> spark plugs in and set the heads with the combustion chambers facing up. >> Fill the chambers with some light liquid like WD-40 or even carb cleaner. >> You will find leaking valves real fast. > > Thanks. I'll give that a shot before I dig further into the valves. I saw > a video of someone doing that, but it was on a different type of engine. > > > >> The exhausts should not be ground. >> If the seat are cut or the valves ground the stems should be shortened and >> the springs shimmed to compensate. This is to maintain spring pressure and >> rocker geometry. Adjusting screws should always be replaced. If the valve >> guides are worn it is likely time for new heads. These are a heat the head >> to 400 and cool the guides in liquid nitrogen fit. Otherwise they tend to >> go >> in off center and the seats will need a lot of cutting to compensate. > > ...and I though the spring tool was going to be fiddly. > > They are newish AMC heads, no pitting (aside from some crowbar scratches). > I think they were done 5-10 years ago according to the receipts log, but > I'm not sure both sides were done at the same time. I've read the bit > about the AMC valves being terrible. I'll do some more reading up on how > to check those (aside from WD-40 test) > > > Back >> when VW rebuilt these heads they almost always ended up drilled out and >> fitted with oversized guides. A lot of labor. Make sure the intakes get the >> oil seals. ETKA does not show them but they should be there. I have a bunch >> in stock. They will keep oil from getting sucked down the intake guides. >> > and that would help prevent the valves and cylinder getting filthier? > > > > You need to remove that carbon ridge at the top of the cylinder. The new top >> ring can get broken hitting it. If honing the cylinders remove as little >> material as possible. A few more thousandths and you will have an engine >> with piston slap noises. With the cylinders out at least measure the rods >> for play and bearing wear. The rods and bearings can be replaced without >> splitting the case, (this sucks but do-able). >> > I've been reluctant to pull any more cylinders out until I try getting one > back on. > > > Good luck, >> Dennis > > Thanks Dennis - very much appreciated. > > Tom >


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