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Date:         Sun, 12 Jan 2014 17:48:46 -0600
Reply-To:     Jim Felder <jim.felder@GMAIL.COM>
Sender:       Vanagon Mailing List <vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com>
From:         Jim Felder <jim.felder@GMAIL.COM>
Subject:      Re: Engine woes - what to do? Cars with more possiblities!
Comments: To: "SDF ( Scott Daniel Foss )" <scottdaniel@turbovans.com>
In-Reply-To:  <52D2F014.1000705@turbovans.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1

My wife had an XJ6 with a jag engine, it would have been better off with a V8 for sure. But the XJ6 is NEVER going to be a collector car. They simply won't last long enough in any respect. They do not share the heritage with the breed that Vanagons share with the iconic bus.

Vanagons are already moving inexorably into the collector direction. Right now, they are in transition and are still more valuable for their utility than anything else (but there are exceptions to this), so a conversion with more power and reliability might fetch more than a stock vanagon TODAY. But where they are headed is this: a kid born today is going to want the vanagon as much as a loaf in 35 or 40 years (assuming fossil fuel vehicles are allowed on the road, but I can guarantee that somewhere in the world, that won't be a problem in 2045), and no splitties will be available. While they will probably never be in the price range with splitties, which will be over $200,000 by then for a really nice example, the price might be $70,000 or so, which might be $10,000 more than a typical new car costs by then. Just eyeballing the trajectories of these things.

Anything not original, as with all collectors, will make the car worth less. It doesn't matter if you are collecting sewing machines, art deco furniture, crosscut saw sharpeners, hatpins or tractors. Originality will provide the most value in the end. Flamers, I did not say for now. But in the future, no conversion will be worth as much as a stocker.

History is 100% against ye who believe otherwise.

Jim

On Sun, Jan 12, 2014 at 1:42 PM, SDF ( Scott Daniel Foss ) < scottdaniel@turbovans.com> wrote:

> it's not fridae so let's stop here. > briefly though ..the Jag XJ 6 engine is a huge lump of iron that dates > from 1947 I think. Fantastic when it came out . > and used until the early 90's even I think....by then it was desperately > outmoded. And the chevy engine weighs less, has more power and if far > less finnacy ( sp ? spell checker can't figure it out either ) > ..especially over the carbed jag engine that soldiered on until 1986 in > the JX6. > > > > > On 1/12/2014 6:20 AM, Todd Last wrote: > >> Yes, but note the resale value for a Jag with a chevy engine. >> The whole reason for having a Jag or a Mercedes is the engine. >> Removing that, kills the resale value. >> >> Todd >> >> On 12/25/2013 11:52 AM, Scott Daniel wrote: >> >>> for example the popular Chevy V-8 in the Jaguar XJ6 >>> Possibly hundreds of those have been done. Possibly more than that >>> even. >>> Very likely there are kits for that conversion. >>> >>> I've seen a Mercedes sedan ..the popular 300D body style from about >>> 1984, with a .. >>> A carbureted Chev V-8 and chevy auto trans dropped into. They guy >>> nagged me to buy it even ..for $ 2,000 or so, well less than what he >>> had into it. Had a large goofy wing on the trunk too. If I didn't >>> already own 20 vehicles ........... >>> >>> >>> I believe the 'small block' chevy V-8 engine, first introduced in 1955 >>> with 265 cubic inches displacement.. >>> and with variations and other versions with larger displacements, was >>> produced into 2000's and may still yet be in production.. >>> >>> I think no basic engine design on earth has had so many examples >>> produced.. >>> in the 10's of millions of them. >>> And that engine is generally the most common hot rod or conversion >>> engine ever, certainly in North America, >>> and around the world, GM of Australia for example. I'm sure they know >>> that engine well ther. >>> >>> Merry ! >>> Scott >>> >>> >>> >>> On 12/25/2013 11:40 AM, Dennis Haynes wrote: >>> >>>> Yes! Any car with a conventional front engine driving the rear wheels >>>> via >>>> drive shaft and solid rear axle. On all of these use most any >>>> engine-transmission assembly your wish and even change the rear axle! >>>> >>>> Dennis >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: Vanagon Mailing List [mailto:vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com] On >>>> Behalf Of >>>> Jim Felder >>>> Sent: Tuesday, December 24, 2013 3:08 PM >>>> To: vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM >>>> Subject: Re: Engine woes - what to do? >>>> >>>> Does anyone know of a car that has more engine swap possibilities >>>> than a >>>> Vanagon? >>>> >>>> Jim >>>> >>>> >>>> On Tue, Dec 24, 2013 at 6:28 AM, Jack R <jack007@comcast.net> wrote: >>>> >>>> I know a couple volks who are very pleased with their Bostig >>>>> conversion. >>>>> http://www.bostig.com/ >>>>> >>>>> In my case, I came very close to putting in a 2.5l 5 cly TDI (owned >>>>> the motor, and was ready to proceed), but the cost to beef up the >>>>> trans due to the torque of a diesel among many other things, resulted >>>>> in converting my >>>>> 84 >>>>> Wolfie to a 2.1L out of a 91 in tip top shape. Very pleased in all. >>>>> As I use my Westie for a few weekends of Michigan Camping, and put >>>>> about 5,000 miles on it a year, the ROI from the costly conversion to >>>>> get more MPG or performance is not there for me. >>>>> >>>>> Each conversion is a unique decision, and Scott makes some valid >>>>> points on your current situation. >>>>> >>>>> Good luck with whatever you do... I'll speak for everyone on this >>>>> list, we ALL hate to see any Vanagon leave circulation!! >>>>> >>>>> Jack R. >>>>> 84 Westy Wolfie with a 2.1L (owned since 87, and restored to original >>>>> splendor) >>>>> >>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>> From: Vanagon Mailing List [mailto:vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com] On >>>>> Behalf Of Scott Daniel >>>>> Sent: Tuesday, December 24, 2013 7:14 AM >>>>> To: vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM >>>>> Subject: Re: Engine woes - what to do? >>>>> >>>>> I'll have to second this. Inline 4 gasser didn't pop into my mind as a >>>>> solution out of the poster's current delema .. >>>>> but yeah .. >>>>> simple , cheap, durable, easily repalced, all VW , good fuel economy, >>>>> decent power .. >>>>> there is a lot to like in a VW-based I4 gasser conversion. >>>>> >>>>> ...if I ever find time to my to play with my 3 actually.... ..mutter >>>>> mutter. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> On 12/23/2013 4:07 PM, Don Hanson wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> I'll chime in for the inline VW swap as probably the simplest and >>>>>> most >>>>>> economical way to go. Like Jim, I really like the power, the fuel >>>>>> economy and the overall simplicity of having a VW motor on VW >>>>>> parts in >>>>>> my VW van. I did keep the Digifant 1.8 liter head and all the >>>>>> wires >>>>>> do plug right in, pretty much. It bolts right in using VW diesel >>>>>> parts that are available and proven...the diesel VW engine is the >>>>>> same block as the gasser, so all the parts for mounting it are >>>>>> factory >>>>>> stock. ABA blocks are also identical. My motor cost me about $600 >>>>>> to build from a $300 Jetta ABA and I sold off the extra parts to >>>>>> almost make a profit. >>>>>> You can find almost unlimited inline VW motors for under $500 >>>>>> all over everywhere. The only downside is there is no one source of >>>>>> information on this particular swap, not that it needs a lot of >>>>>> explaining. Inline parts are dirt cheap, they are simple to work on >>>>>> and quite robust. I was a VW rookie when I got mine already >>>>>> converted, but the fellow who did the conversion was a carpenter and >>>>>> not a mechanic. I've since done a lot of swapping around and >>>>>> messing with it, mainly to learn and because they are so cheap and >>>>>> simple....They are easy to mess with....I never HAD to work on mine >>>>>> much, but I chose to go to the ABA 2.0 liter block after reading >>>>>> about it and finding one for $300...Took me 2 days, about to swap all >>>>>> >>>>> the >>>> >>>>> stuff over and re-install it into my van. I have a spare motor now, >>>>>> too...should I ever need one. >>>>>> >>>>>> On Mon, Dec 23, 2013 at 1:09 PM, Todd Last <rubatoguy@comcast.net> >>>>>> >>>>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> After almost 230,00 miles my '88 Vanagon is displaying symptoms of >>>>>>> a >>>>>>> >>>>>> head >>>>> leak - I have not yet confirmed this or done a recent compression >>>>> test, but plan to do so. I have concluded that one of the worst >>>>> things you can do to your van is not use it. Bad things happen when >>>>> they >>>>> >>>> are left sitting! >>>> >>>>> In any case I am looking at my options, and started out thinking >>>>>>> about >>>>>>> >>>>>> replacing the heads, then thought if I was going to do that, I might >>>>> as well put in new piston rings too, and well, once you do that you >>>>> might as well go a step farther and do an engine rebuild. Of course, >>>>> once you get there, the question becomes, stock, modified (like >>>>> GoWesty) or engine swap. In looking at these options, it looks like a >>>>> cost of $5,000 or more. From what I have seen, Subaru conversions can >>>>> reach over $10K. Yikes! >>>>> >>>>>> I was wondering if I could get opinions on the best course of >>>>>>> action in >>>>>>> >>>>>> this situation, not wanting to spend tens of thousands of dollars. >>>>> Would list memebers give me their 2 cents worth and if possible, what >>>>> the aproximate costs for the various solutions range from? I'm not >>>>> sure if it makes more sence to just install new heads and hope for the >>>>> best, or go full bore and swap the engine. >>>>> >>>>>> What does the voice of experience say? Anyone out there have >>>>>>> opinions on >>>>>>> >>>>>> the GoWesty performance engines vs. a Subaru transplant? >>>>> >>>>>> Thanks, >>>>>>> Todd >>>>>>> '88 Westy >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>> >>


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