Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2014 08:51:35 -0500
Reply-To: phishman068@GMAIL.COM
Sender: Vanagon Mailing List <vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com>
From: Craig Cowan <phishman068@GMAIL.COM>
Subject: Re: Starting system quirk - diagnosis help needed
In-Reply-To: <CA+r=JhqSNN1QQ6Qv_=4PPbryRz7FQfm6jPz6wk_GD2jSbfC6vw@mail.gmail.com>
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A few things I have learned from having exactly the same problem on a few late model automatic vans....
It's probably your grounds! Clean the ground at the batter terminal and where the ground strap attaches to the body, and add a new thick ground strap from the starter nut to the frame.
Check and clean your neutral safety switch, in an automatic all the power strangely has to go through a little switch in the shift column known to fail.
Lastly, a hard start relay kit is a good move, unless you have a 90/91 model automatic van with cruise control. For whatever reason those, you can't install a relay kit in ( it won't disengage the starter, last I heard jay brown was looking into it but still hadn't figured it out).
I do not proactively replace ignition switches, as I find the bulk of those available today to have a very high failure rate.
-craig
> On Feb 17, 2014, at 7:31 AM, Larry Alofs <lalofs@GMAIL.COM> wrote:
>
> It takes significant current to activate the starter solenoid, especially
> as it ages. This is rough on the contacts in the ignition switch.
> Replacing the switch and cleaning or replacing the starter and/or solenoid
> may solve the problem. Regardless, the system is under-engineered and
> failure prone. Many more modern vehicles (including Eurovans from VW) use
> a relay between the switch and the solenoid.
> Some of our on-line vendors sell a "hard start relay" kit to address this
> problem on Vanagons.
>
> Larry A.
>
>
>
>> On Sun, Feb 16, 2014 at 9:23 AM, David <okdavid5555@cox.net> wrote:
>>
>> Thank you, list members, for all the advice about my quirky starter. Looks
>> like replacing the ignition switch is my first priority, and then maybe
>> repair or replace the starter. I appreciate all the suggestions and help
>> very much!
>>
>> David S.
>> Oklahoma City
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Vanagon Mailing List [mailto:vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com] On Behalf Of
>> David
>> Sent: Saturday, February 15, 2014 3:20 PM
>> To: vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM
>> Subject: Starting system quirk - diagnosis help needed
>>
>> Hello Vanagon listers. I've been a list member for quite a while, but have
>> contributed infrequently, only when I think I might be able to actually add
>> something worthwhile to a discussion. I've never asked a question about my
>> own Vanagon, but now I'd appreciate some help.
>>
>>
>>
>> I've got a stock '91 Carat, automatic trans, with 145K miles (60K put on by
>> me). I've experienced this issue a number of times over the past six months
>> or so, and it was never a problem until about a month ago when I thought it
>> was going to strand me.
>>
>>
>>
>> Here's the symptom: When turning the ignition key to the "start" position,
>> every once in a while, there is a very brief period of nothing happening,
>> ranging from a split-second to maybe a half-second. Continuing to hold the
>> key in the start position, the starter kicks in and the engine starts as
>> normal.
>>
>>
>>
>> I emphasize that this happens infrequently, and when it does, the period of
>> time before the starter kicks in is usually almost imperceptible, but it's
>> enough of a delay that you're aware of it happening. There does not appear
>> to be a correlation between outside air temp or whether the engine is warm
>> or cold.
>>
>>
>>
>> About a month ago, when I was 100 miles from home, I turned the key to the
>> start position and nothing happened. Nothing. The usual dash warning lights
>> lit up when the switch passed through the "run" position, and when in the
>> start position, nothing happened. There was no dimming of the warning
>> lights; no sound (like a click, for instance) at all. No indication that a
>> load was being placed on the electrical system. The no-sound and
>> no-light-dimming seemed very odd to me. I repeated the
>> turn-off-try-to-start-again sequence several times, which yielded no
>> change.
>> Then I got the idea that maybe the neutral safety switch was the problem,
>> so
>> I moved the gear selector from "P" to "N" and tried again - several times -
>> with the same result. I even rapidly moved the gear selector back and forth
>> from "P" to "1" several times, thinking I would "clear" or shake loose (?)
>> the contact mechanism. This resulted in no change when trying to start in
>> either "P" and "N."
>>
>>
>>
>> Frustrated, I got out of the van and walked around it in dismay. I even
>> looked on the ground under the engine - as if I'd find some part had
>> dropped
>> on the ground or was hanging loose (isn't looking at and underneath the
>> engine what we're "supposed to do" when something's wrong? J )
>>
>>
>>
>> After about 10 minutes of being thoroughly upset and confused, I crawled
>> back in the driver's seat figuring I was going to have to call a wrecker. I
>> decided to give it one last try before grabbing the cell phone, and to my
>> amazement, it started right up, without any perceived delay.
>>
>>
>>
>> It has started perfectly since then, however, the infrequent, very brief
>> delay episodes have continued.
>>
>>
>>
>> I would appreciate any advice on diagnosing where the problem may lay.
>> Thank you.
>>
>>
>>
>> David S.
>>
>> Oklahoma City
>>
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