Date: Wed, 19 Aug 2015 18:37:21 -0700
Reply-To: Bruce Todd <beeceetee@GMAIL.COM>
Sender: Vanagon Mailing List <vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com>
From: Bruce Todd <beeceetee@GMAIL.COM>
Subject: Re: Coil-itis
In-Reply-To: <CA+r=JhodTEE+pefXa7SoXpGkuW1zE09_Rt7PgC9JObNO-D0r6g@mail.gmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8
Thanks Larry for your input and diagnosis - the plugs have always looked
normal to me when observed - no deposits or defects and fairly recently
replaced approx 8.5 K km ago ...I will recheck them however and see what
they look like for clues.
Plug wires are Bosch and were replaced 20 K km ago (3 years ago) - I can
check those as well however they appear to be in good shape and not overly
old.
Bruce
On Wed, Aug 19, 2015 at 6:08 AM, Larry Alofs <lalofs@gmail.com> wrote:
> Bruce,
> Since your resistance measurements show a fault on the secondary (high
> voltage) side of the coil, this would indicate a problem in the high
> voltage wires. A few posts back Dennis suggested that bad plug wires could
> harm a coil. Have these been tested and/or replaced? How do the plugs
> look?
>
> Larry A.
>
>
> On Tue, Aug 18, 2015 at 7:56 PM, Bruce Todd <beeceetee@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> To be honest - I disagree with the moving and jostling of parts having the
>> effect of repairing the coil - as opposed to installing a new coil which
>> in
>> the short term and temporarily (?) has solved the problem. The resistance
>> readings yesterday confirm the coil does not work. How it got to that
>> state
>> is the question. Wiring, grounds, current, hall senders, etc could all be
>> part of the equation as well as crappy workmanship...and certainly the
>> current remedy (a new coil) may not be the long term answer as there quite
>> possibly is a wiring conspiracy going on somewhere in my van - which I
>> need
>> to sort out and as well as thankful for the responses I have received so
>> far!
>>
>> By reinstalling the old coil and finding that the engine would not start
>> tells me that the wiring either had to be jostled back into a state of ill
>> repair and then be re-jostled back into a state of repair when the new
>> coil
>> was again hooked up - basically 5 minutes later.
>>
>> Coil readings between terminal 1 & 15 = 0.6 ohms which is normal.
>> Readings
>> between terminal 4 and 15 read infinity (should be 2.4 to 3.5 k-ohm).
>>
>> Having a 29 year old van and a 104 year old house - I'm planning to run
>> knob and tube to my coil :-)
>>
>> BT
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On Tue, Aug 18, 2015 at 5:30 AM, James <jk_eaton@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > *Yesterday after installing the new coil the van> fired up right
>> away...a
>> > bad ground or a wiring issue would not permit that> to happen.*That's a
>> > dangerous assumption on an old vehicle - if the problem is a break or
>> > weakness inside a connector, crimp, or the wiring itself (often caused
>> by
>> > heat, and all possible in old vehicles), then the mere act of
>> uninstalling
>> > and re-installing the coil could well jostle the parts back into
>> alignment
>> > so the engine will start and run until the heat or vibration causes the
>> > ground or wiring problem to re-occur.
>> >
>> > Sometimes, new wiring and connections are the only answer. I have a 50
>> > year old house and a 24 year old Westfalia; in both cases, the
>> replacement
>> > of failing wiring and connectors has begun.
>> >
>> > James
>> > Ottawa, ON
>> >
>> > > Date: Sun, 16 Aug 2015 17:50:54 -0700
>> > > From: beeceetee@GMAIL.COM
>> > > Subject: Re: Coil-itis
>> > > To: vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM
>> >
>> > >
>> > > Yeah Jack that is what makes me wonder - (old coil - no problems)...or
>> > > whether the new coils are not up to par. Good advice on the ground
>> wires
>> > > which I have done some work with over the years...but i don't think
>> bad
>> > > grounds would kill a coil.
>> >
>> > *Yesterday after installing the new coil the van> fired up right
>> away...a
>> > bad ground or a wiring issue would not permit that> to happen.*
>>
>> > >
>> > > I need to have an autopsy completed on the coil - not sure whether I
>> > could
>> > > trust Bosch to do that and provide honest feedback.
>> > >
>> > > BT
>> > >
>> > > On Sun, Aug 16, 2015 at 5:29 PM, Jack Reynaert <jack007@comcast.net>
>> > wrote:
>> > >
>> > > > Bruce,
>> > > >
>> > > >
>> > > >
>> > > > One final thing… make sure you have a real solid ground too.
>> (engine to
>> > > > chasse, battery to box/chasse, starter etc.) We grinded all the
>> contact
>> > > > points (used Dielectric Grease), and replaced ground straps, with
>> top
>> > > > quality everywhere. (can’t be too careful).
>> > > >
>> > > >
>> > > >
>> > > > I just helped change out the motor on our friends 90 Westy, with a
>> Go
>> > > > Westy 2.2. When we went to fire it the first time last week, no
>> spark!
>> > > > One of the coil wires connecting to the spade was bad.
>> > > >
>> > > > That’s what made me think of this possibility too.
>> > > >
>> > > >
>> > > >
>> > > > My 84 Westy has a 2.1l from a 91 Syncro in it, and the original coil
>> > from
>> > > > that motor as well. The motor only has 50K original miles on it, so
>> I
>> > > > think I’ll try to make sure I avoid the Brazilian factory workers if
>> > at all
>> > > > possible J.
>> > > >
>> > > > I was thinking of doing some PM and replacing my coil, simply due to
>> > age…
>> > > > but now I’m not going to mess with a good thing.
>> > > >
>> > > >
>> > > >
>> > > > Jack
>> > > >
>> > > >
>> > > >
>> > > > *From:* Bruce Todd [mailto:beeceetee@gmail.com]
>> > > > *Sent:* Sunday, August 16, 2015 8:22 PM
>> > > > *To:* Jack Reynaert
>> > > > *Subject:* Re: Coil-itis
>> >
>> > > >
>> > > >
>> > > >
>> > > > Hi Jack,
>> > > >
>> > > >
>> > > >
>> > > > Plug wires are tight and quite new. Spade connectors are connected
>> > > > properly and are tight / clean surfaces on spades and wire
>> > connections. I
>> > > > am not sure on the condition of the wires though and whether they
>> are
>> > > > shorting - I can check those. My thoughts are this is unlikely
>> given I
>> > > > had my mechanic inspect the electrical system and coil specifically
>> > before
>> > > > the trip - but I won't rule out the possibility.
>> > > >
>> > > >
>> > > >
>> > > > Yes - what ever is happening is pooching the coil. Or the Brazilian
>> > > > factory workers are working to rule.
>> > > >
>> > > >
>> > > >
>> > > > BT
>> > > >
>> > > >
>> > > >
>> > > > On Sun, Aug 16, 2015 at 4:06 PM, Jack Reynaert <jack007@comcast.net
>> >
>> > > > wrote:
>> > > >
>> > > > Bruce,
>> > > >
>> > > > Have you checked your wires connecting to the coil, to make sure
>> that
>> > > > there are no nicks, or shorts or corrosion internally in the wires?
>> > > > There are two spade connectors on the coil, both need to be
>> connected
>> > for
>> > > > it to start, then of course your plug wires.
>> > > > Sounds like more like another issue causing your "Coil-it is", than
>> > > > defective coils.
>> > > >
>> > > > If all else fails, try a high fiber diet... and try to reduce your
>> > stress
>> > > > :)
>> > > >
>> > > > Good luck!
>> > > >
>> > > > Jack
>> > > >
>> > > >
>> > > > -----Original Message-----
>> > > > From: Vanagon Mailing List [mailto:vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com] On
>> > Behalf
>> > > > Of Bruce Todd
>> > > > Sent: Sunday, August 16, 2015 6:47 PM
>> > > > To: vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM
>> > > > Subject: Coil-itis
>> > > >
>> > > > You may or may not read my travel post from yesterday - great trip
>> down
>> > > > the Olympic Peninsula and halfway down Oregon coast. At the heart of
>> > the
>> > > > matter was that my coil packed it in about 3 km from home. A mixed
>> > > > blessing of sorts given the rush hour driving we completed in
>> Portland
>> > on
>> > > > the I-5, the number of large bridges we crossed, and some of the
>> remote
>> > > > highways we traversed.
>> > > >
>> > > > I have now replaced 4 coils since July 10 of 2012 = here are the
>> makes
>> > of
>> > > > coils, dates of purchase & install and odometer reading in (kms).
>> > > >
>> > > > July 10, 2012- Beck Arnley Coil (267,951) replaced the original (?)
>> > black
>> > > > Bosch coil - I bought the van in the Summer of 2006 (228,394). as a
>> > > > preventative measure.
>> > > >
>> > > > Sept 28, 2012 - New Bosch coil (270,965) replaced Beck Arnley
>> (failed)
>> > > >
>> > > > Feb 8, 2014 - Replaced new Bosch Coil with spare (original coil)
>> > (279,376)
>> > > > (new Bosch coil failed)
>> > > >
>> > > > October 22, 2014 - Replaced spare coil with 2nd New Bosch coil
>> > (283,980)
>> > > > (Mechanic accidentally kept spare coil which I have not yet got
>> back)
>> > > >
>> > > > August 15, 2015 - Replaced 2nd Bosch coil with 3rd Bosch coil
>> > (289,578).
>> > > >
>> > > > I just sent off an email to Bosch Canada given that this could be
>> some
>> > > > poor workmanship or perhaps some bad luck on my part. What
>> > mechanically or
>> > > > more specifically electronically do people think could be possibly
>> > > > contributing to this issue.
>> > > >
>> > > > One last thing - I did post last October on the heat I noticed from
>> the
>> > > > 2nd Bosch coil - ? Subject line: Coil Boil
>> > > >
>> > > > Thanks all.
>> > > >
>> > > > Bruce Todd
>> > > >
>> > > > 86 Westy Syncro
>> > > >
>> > > >
>> > > >
>> >
>>
>
>
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