Date: Sat, 10 Oct 2015 16:45:52 -1000
Reply-To: "SDF ( aka ;jim lahey' - Scott )" <scottdaniel@TURBOVANS.COM>
Sender: Vanagon Mailing List <vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com>
From: "SDF ( aka ;jim lahey' - Scott )" <scottdaniel@TURBOVANS.COM>
Organization: Cosmic Reminders
Subject: Re: Help me diagnose and fix no brake lights
In-Reply-To: <CAFnDXk3m6+_TxQX+J+rsUOy1Zbfzhf+a0RwWshska5u=4b8bwg@mail.gmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed
'short in a connector' ?
perhaps you mean 'an open' in a connector ...??
On 10/10/2015 2:45 AM, Jim Felder wrote:
> I had a 1990 Vanagon bought new. In about 2000, I was working in an office
> when someone cam in saying "you left your light on." I checked and it was
> the brake lights, which I could not make go off. I was able to use the
> googles on the inter webs in cyberspace to find the answer:both OEM
> switches had failed at ten years.
>
> As far as I know, my 83 diesel camper had the original switches in it two
> years ago when I replaced all the brake stuff top to bottom, the switches
> included. The ones in the car were replaced for good measure, not because
> they had failed.
>
> As it turned out, I did not need to buy two new switches yesterday. The
> problem was a pesky one, a short in a connector, and was unique enough to
> my vanagon that nothing that specific came up on the googles, that would be
> like googling the pain in your foot and reading an article about how you
> had a thumbtack in your left shoe near the second toe.
>
> Anyway, brake lights are one of the most important safety features on the
> car, and I don't mind knowing that at least my switches will be good for a
> few more years. With old cars like these, it's probably a good idea to back
> into your garage once a month just to see if you can see if the lights are
> working.
>
> Jim
>
>
> On Fri, Oct 9, 2015 at 6:32 PM SDF ( aka ;jim lahey' - Scott ) <
> scottdaniel@turbovans.com> wrote:
>
>> Hi Jim,
>> yep ..I hear ya.
>> altho ..
>> I have had numerous cases recently where I would never know or be able to
>> find out something..
>> unless I asked online.
>>
>> Have you always wondered what ( WTF ) time , for tv shows , for example
>> 9/8C is ?
>>
>> I sure have .. Never could figure that one out, and it does not correlate
>> with time zones.
>> I ask online ..
>> another person is asking that just like me.
>>
>> A guy answers ..some guy from TV networks ..
>> no direct logic either ..but I did find out 9 /8C is 9 o'clock
>> ............the first number on the west coast that applies.
>> NEVER could have figured that out otherwise..
>> perhaps call a TV station ....wouldn't surprise me if they didn't know
>> either.
>>
>> I google 'all the frickin' time' !
>> The world's biggest library right at our fingertips.
>>
>> you probably could find forum conversations about 'vanagon brake lights
>> not working' ..in just seconds.
>>
>> yeah..this page is covered with that exact topic...many entries.
>> took all of 4 seconds if that.
>> I googled 'vanagon brake lights not working' to find these listings.
>>
>>
>> https://www.google.com/webhp?sourceid=chrome-instant&rlz=1C1TLCE_enUS574US654&ion=1&espv=2&ie=UTF-8#q=vanagon%20brake%20lights%20not%20working
>>
>> On 10/9/2015 12:52 PM, Jim Felder wrote:
>>
>> I have the googles, but have spent the day actually fixing the issue. Not
>> looking for DIN wiring standards directly, as I was occupied with a
>> voltmeter and the wiring system before me. Interesting in retrospect,
>> though. Thanks for the tip to use the googles.
>>
>> Jim
>>
>> On Fri, Oct 9, 2015 at 5:49 PM SDF ( aka ;jim lahey' - Scott ) <scottdaniel@turbovans.com> wrote:
>>
>>
>> it was amazingly difficult to google
>> " DIN wiring standards' or whatever I put.
>>
>> in all of 1.06 seconds this pops up ..
>> http://www.bosch-automotive-tradition.com/media/en/automotive_tradition_1/teile_1/switches/downloads_3/klemmenbezeichnungen.pdf
>>
>> you maybe no have google ????
>> you could/should search yourself some ...about half a dozen interesting
>> things popped up ...all related to this topic.
>> More than that even.
>>
>>
>> S.
>>
>> On 10/9/2015 12:26 PM, Jim Felder wrote:
>>
>> Let us know if you find that list.
>>
>> Jim
>>
>> On Fri, Oct 9, 2015 at 5:25 PM SDF ( aka ;jim lahey' - Scott ) <scottdaniel@turbovans.com> wrote:
>>
>>
>> that reminds me ..
>> somewhere I found, online, a whole list of 'DIN' standards for wiring
>> diagram symbols and such.
>>
>> this list also tells what numbers are used in terminal naming ..1 is
>> always ground,
>> 15 is always key on power, etc. Very useful list.
>>
>> also that the very beginning of the electrical section of Bentley I think
>> there's a list of symbols.
>>
>>
>> On 10/9/2015 11:40 AM, Jim Felder wrote:
>>
>> Regarding scott's observation that it takes more pressure on the pedal than
>> you think to operate the brake lights—I cut a 3/4 inch dowel that jams very
>> tightly between the underside lower steering wheel and the brake pedal.
>> It's there when you want it, not when you don't, and it puts considerable
>> pressure on the system. Five minutes on full down is plenty enough to see
>> if your connections are weeping brake fluid, another benefit.
>>
>> Also Scott's observation that the Bentley diagrams require a lot of study,
>> that's true too. You need it right there as you look and look and look. It
>> would help to know what all the symbols are, maybe that's in there but I
>> didn't find it but ended up figuring it out.
>>
>> That 4-pin connector that red-black goes through that goes through the
>> firewall--it has four wires coming in and its mate going to the under dash
>> harness only has three wires. Go figure why they dead-ended that one wire.
>>
>> Jim
>>
>> On Fri, Oct 9, 2015 at 4:12 PM vw_van_fan_Mark <madvws@cox.net> <madvws@cox.net> <madvws@cox.net> <madvws@cox.net> wrote:
>>
>>
>> Only 80-84 vans have the brake failure warning setup. These use 3 wire
>> switches to supply the signals to the dash warning module and the rear
>> brake lights. 85-91 vans use 2 wire switches, only for the rear brake
>> lights.
>>
>> For some reason new switch quality seems low and the supply of new 2
>> wire switches is even lower.
>>
>> Mark
>>
>>
>> SDF ( aka ;jim lahey' - Scott ) wrote:
>>
>> re this brake warning light module K ...
>> .................
>>
>> Obviously the swtiches , one or both I imagine, turn on the brake lights.
>> the 'other function ' is for a legally required brake failure warning
>>
>> light
>>
>> in this system I'm pretty sure that if there is a significant difference
>> in pressures between the two circuits
>> ( like say a rear wheel cylinder is leaking badly ) ..
>> the two brake light switches tell this info to the module ..
>> the module sees 'no pressure in one side' compared to the other
>> circuit. thus turning on the warning light .
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
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