Date: Mon, 18 Jan 2016 19:06:14 -0500
Reply-To: Ed McLean <email99@BELLSOUTH.NET>
Sender: Vanagon Mailing List <vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com>
From: Ed McLean <email99@BELLSOUTH.NET>
Subject: Re: Upper control arm bushings failed again, upgrade advice sought
Christopher,
Thanks for the informative response. Your comments and product
descriptions are very helpful.
Your representation of the failure rates for Powerflex and Whiteline
bushings is better that expected for excellent products that are being
installed sometimes by unskilled vehicle owners.
On T3 Technique's website I don't find Whiteline upper control arm
bushings, although I do find them on the Whiteline website. Would you
compare and contrast for us the Powerflex and Whiteline upper control
arm bushings?
Thanks again,
Ed
On Mon, 18 Jan 2016 14:51:55 -0800, T3 Technique
<christopher@T3TECHNIQUE.COM> wrote:
>Hi Ed,
>
> Some may feel that I shouldn't be answering this due to having an
interest in certain bushings, but those that know me are aware that I am
always very honest about the information that I share. That said, you
should still take this with a grain of salt.
>
> I obviously sell the Powerflex and Whiteline upper control arm
bushings. I have literally sold thousands of them (fewer of the
Whiteline upper control arm bushings because they are much newer). Out
of those thousands, there have been a few bushings that failed over the
years. However, the same can be said for many, many products. Very few
products have a perfect track record. I think I have had somewhere in
the neighborhood of 10-12 Powerflex upper control arm bushings that have
failed and zero Whiteline upper control arm bushings have failed (a much
smaller number of them are on the road) . There is a lifetime warranty
on both of these products. While no one wants to have to replace upper
control arm bushings because they failed, at least the parts are 100%
covered.
>I have over 100,000 miles on my personal 2wd with the Powerflex UCA
bushings and they have never been touched, not even to change the
grease. They are as quiet today as they were from day one. I have other
customers with mileage up near that range and same thing with them. As
long as the proper grease is used (and used liberally) during
installation, there is no problem with noise.
>
> You do not need to tack weld the Powerflex or the Whiteline upper
control arm bushing shells into the upper control arm if they press
tightly into place. There have only been a couple of reported situations
where the shells did not press into the arms tightly. In those cases, it
seems that the arms were possibly abused during previous bushing
replacements which deformed the hole. I suppose it is possible for
corrosion to be concern when considering the hole size, but I have never
seen this happen. I always advise customers to press the shells in
place, making sure to pay attention to how much effort it takes. If it
seems like the effort to press the shells in is too light, than they
should tack them in place for added insurance.
>
>As for the other bushings out there that are made with much harder
material for the bushing portion (be it Delrin, rod ends with PTFE
liners or other materials that have almost zero isolation properties),
the harder bushing material transfers much more road vibration and
harshness into the chassis since there is almost no isolation properties
in the bushing material. This is most commonly felt on roads with rough,
gravely surfaces and when hitting things like expansion joints and pot
holes. You will not feel a difference when hitting smoother bumps. I am
not saying this as a theoretical possibility. I'm saying this having
experienced and tested a number of different bushings designs and
materials so that I could speak honestly about the differences.
>
> I hope that helps explain a bit about the Powerflex and Whiteline
upper control arm bushings, but please feel free to ask if you have any
questions.
>
>Thanks,
>Christopher
>www.t3technique.com
>
>
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: Vanagon Mailing List [mailto:vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com] On Behalf
Of email99@bellsouth.net
>Sent: Monday, January 18, 2016 1:43 PM
>To: vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM
>Subject: Upper control arm bushings failed again, upgrade advice sought
>
>Well, three years ago I replaced the ball joints, tie rod ends and
upper control arm bushings on my '86 Westy, putting grease fittings in
the ball joints and tie rod ends. The greased joints are still tight
but the upper control arm bushings are clunking and squeaking on one
side once again. Only a long time Vanagon owner can appreciate how
frustrating this is. I can't recall how many times I have done this in
the past 24 years.
>
>So it's time to fix it again and I can't see using original design
bushings so I'll ask the list to share its knowledge.
>
>
>Are there upper control arm bushing upgrades other than those produced
by GoWesty and those produced by T3 Technique?
>
>What experience have people had with these upgrades? What problems?
>
>How many miles do you have on them and are they still tight? Do they
make noise? Have any failed? Is there a noticeable difference in the
ride? Are GoWesty bushings secure without spot welding? What is your
perception of the design and quality of the parts? Do you have any
other comments?
>
>
>I appreciate any and all comments about the upper control arm bushings.
>You may post these back to the list or send them only to my email if
you wish.
>
>Thanks in advance.
>
>Ed
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