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Date:         Sat, 2 Jul 2016 09:25:43 -0500
Reply-To:     John Rodgers <jrodgers113@GMAIL.COM>
Sender:       Vanagon Mailing List <vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com>
From:         John Rodgers <jrodgers113@GMAIL.COM>
Subject:      Re: Air conditioning
Comments: To: Dennis Haynes <d23haynes57@hotmail.com>
In-Reply-To:  <BAY405-EAS11452384899CA76D728BDBBA0260@phx.gbl>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8

But we are all kind of nuts and love our Vanagons!!

John On Jul 2, 2016 08:38, "Dennis Haynes" <d23haynes57@hotmail.com> wrote:

> I definitely agree with Larry. One thing you will find as a new Vanagon > owner is that most regular shops are not equipped or willing to bother with > vehicles of this vintage, never mind the Vanagon with its idiosyncrasies. > > The air conditioning is American based but its installation layout makes > for some servicing difficulties. The evaporators never go bad, the only > thing that happens to them is they get clogged with dirt or the foam > filter-water stopper disintegrates. There is an expansion valve that > sometimes fails and there is a replacement for R-134a conversions. > Servicing the evaporator or expansive valve is a labor intensive operation. > > A first waring sign that you tech was not up to the job is if he knew > where the high side service fitting is. So did he remove the shelf and > corner piece in the rear cabinet to get to it? Not only is it important for > the high side pressure to be checked as part of normal AC operation you > need to make sure the radiator/condenser cooling fan goes into the higher > speed mode as pressure increases ~200 psi. There is a lot of electrical > involvement with this system. > > As for charging the system I have really found that the initial charge > especially R134a has to done by weight. I also find that topping the system > off or using the stuff in cans just doesn’t provide full performance. When > these come on for service I begin by a full recovery. This also tells me > how much was left. Was this a slow leak of do we have a problem. Now that > refrigerant in bulk is cheap I then do a full charge, 1,400 to 1,500 grams > seems to give really good results. Yes this is a bit over charged but all > that hose length takes it. Much more and things will go wacky. > > At best the performance of the Westy AC is bit lacking. You get that nice > cold draft on the back of the head and neck while the sun in your face > keeps it sweating but properly working it provide great relief. > > And yes, > VW- turning drivers into mechanics for over 50 years. You will soon be > joining our club unless you have an awful lot of money. > As for this being low cost way to travel I have some guidelines. > If you couldn’t afford it new, you probably can’t afford it used either > unless you get creative, skilled, and somewhat lucky. > These vehicles were expensive back when they were available and they > didn’t sell well back then. Fun Bus was on the dealers lot for almost 6 > months before I took it home. > It was for sale because some previous owner no longer wanted it. It is > best if you can figure out why. > Whatever you paid it most likely was just a down payment. If you paid a > lot your expectations are high and it will take more to meet or maintain > those expectations. > > Dennis > > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Vanagon Mailing List [mailto:vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com] On Behalf > Of Larry Alofs > Sent: Saturday, July 2, 2016 8:13 AM > To: vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM > Subject: Re: Air conditioning > > You should get a second and third opinion about that evaporator > replacement. There are many other and more likely causes for poor AC > performance, low refrigerant charge being the most likely. > > With a recirculating system, if the air it's taking in is very hot, the > air coming out is not going to be very cold at first. I generally feel > that my AC is working pretty well if it reduces the temp by 30F or so. > This means that if the van has been standing in the sun and the air in back > is 110F, the air coming out of the AC might be 80F at first. After a few > minutes of circulation, it starts to feel more like actual AC. > > Do you know if the system still has R-12 in it or if it has been converted > to 134a or something else? Did this tech actually measure the low and high > side pressures with the system running? It's complicated. :-) > > I think the saying goes something like: "VW, converting owners to > mechanics for over 50 years." > > Larry A. > > > On Sat, Jul 2, 2016 at 3:02 AM, Gordon Mah <gordonmahung@gmail.com> wrote: > > > Thank you Larry, Dennis and Stan, > > > > I'll look for those "Bently" manuals even though I don't have a Bently. > > ;). I know it has freon because the tech I took it to told me that he > > checked it. Problem was that I was expecting air to come out the > > front and side vents too. Yes, they did come out the rear as you guys > > said, although not all that cold. Somebody told me that the > > "evaporator" probably needs replacing. We'll see. I'm realizing that > > Westy owners all seem to be mechanical tinkerers. Does any air ever > > come out from the side vents above the sliding door? > > > > Thanks again. > > -g > > > > Sent from my iPad > > > > > On Jun 29, 2016, at 5:05 PM, Dennis Haynes <d23haynes57@HOTMAIL.COM> > > wrote: > > > > > > So the seller didn't show you how things work. Do you have the > > > owner's manual? You may want to get one. As a Westy or vanagon > > > newbie you will > > want > > > to get a Bentley service manual ASAP. Learn as much as possible > > > before > > tings > > > break and get ready to catch up on some overdue maintenance. If the > > > van > > is > > > low mileage it is a good bet it spent part of its life not running. > > > As > > old > > > dormant systems and rubber/plastic parts are put to use you will be > > > surprised as the things that will need service within a year. > > > > > > Freon is a brand name for refrigerants. How do you know the system > > > has an adequate charge of refrigerant if you don't know how to turn > > > it on? Does > > it > > > even have AC? For an 87 Westy the AC controls are usually to the > > > right of the radio. There is no AC from the dash vents, only the > > > vents over the > > rear > > > seat. It is common for these air conditioners to have both > > > electrical and refrigeration/leakage problems. The electrical is > > > somewhat complicated especially with the interface to the radiator > > > fan. Alldatadiy.com is a > > good > > > choice to get service information including the wiring diagrams. On > > > the Westy most of the AC electrical is inside the rear cabinet. You > > > have to remove a shelf and that corner piece for the electrics ad > > > high side > > service > > > fitting. > > > > > > Dennis > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > From: Vanagon Mailing List [mailto:vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com] On > > > Behalf > > Of > > > Gordon Mah > > > Sent: Wednesday, June 29, 2016 3:08 AM > > > To: vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM > > > Subject: Air conditioning > > > > > > Just bought me a 1989 Westy and I can't figure out how to get the > > > air conditioning to work. It has freon. I tried all the knobs and > > > vent > > sliders > > > and all I get is either heat or just air from the outside. Does > > > anyone > > know > > > the secret combination of sliders and their positions to make this > > > baby > > keep > > > me cool on such hot days? > > > > > > Thanks! > > >


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