Date:         Wed, 4 Oct 2017 20:08:21 -0700
Reply-To:     Neil N <musomuso@GMAIL.COM>
Sender:       Vanagon Mailing List <vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com>
From:         Neil N <musomuso@GMAIL.COM>
Subject:      Re: Determine if new pilot bearing needs replacement?
Comments: To: Dennis Haynes <d23haynes57@hotmail.com>
In-Reply-To:  <BN6PR20MB129774A021743953E2BC0BECA0700@BN6PR20MB1297.namprd20.prod.outlook.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"

I see what you mean Dennis. No. No material was ground off at shiny
parallel length on the shaft. Those fine marks are due to inadvertent
scuffs from 400 grit emery cloth I used to clean up the angled portion
at end that I did grind.

The input shaft you see is being used on a Jetta gas 4 cylinder engine
conversion; it has to be cut shorter and the end has to be chamfered.

Yes. I understand what you mean regarding the input shaft and how it
is connected inside the transmission. It is threaded onto a small
stud, backed off 1 or so turns, then the sleeve and circlip are put
back in place. Heres a neat image of an input shaft R&R I did some
years ago:

https://photos.app.goo.gl/SDZ7sbAqQ9rNr3tu1

https://photos.app.goo.gl/EYyLWzhOsPHphxCG3

Here's an image of the cut shorter input shaft I had been using on my
my daily driver Jetta engine powered Vanagon. I had a shop install a
rebuilt transmission some years ago:

https://photos.app.goo.gl/FRQRZfUxtcGtGpwg2

the marks shown are obviously from the pilot bearing.

Neil.


On 10/4/17, Dennis Haynes <d23haynes57@hotmail.com> wrote:
> It hard to tell in the picture but it looks like you also did some grinding
> on the surface that rides inside the needle bearing. It looks undersized
> compared to the space between the bearing surface and the splines. If you
> did grind there the shaft is garbage. Not only does the shaft and needle
> bearing keep the disc centered but also the shaft where it enters the
> transmission. Where that shaft attaches to the main shaft there is a spline
> coupling that allows for some miss alignment, yes the clutch shaft should
> wobble just a bit. If not properly supported by the pilot bearing the
> transmission can be a leaker. When the pilot bearing or the engine to
> transmission mountings fail it can also cause that coupling to break and
> wipe out the needle bearing at the front of the main shaft. Full
> transmission overhaul time.
>
> Dennis
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Neil N [mailto:musomuso@gmail.com]
> Sent: Wednesday, October 4, 2017 10:02 PM
> To: Dennis Haynes <d23haynes57@hotmail.com>
> Cc: vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM
> Subject: Re: Determine if new pilot bearing needs replacement?
>
> Ahhhh, ok. That makes more sense. The input shaft metal is fairly hard.
>
> During install attempt, I turned the crank to help line up input shaft and
> clutch disk splines. The flywheel DID rub off some tranny case material. I
> can confirm with a magnet I'd guess.
>
> The bearing was pre greased of course but I added a tiny bit more sticky
> grease prior to engine install attempt.
>
> So just for laughs, I came up with an idea for turning the input shaft while
> using my Dremel to grind the chamfer at end of input shaft. (no helper here
> to turn a tire while van in gear).
>
> For list amusement: (images of thing I rigged up)
>
> https://photos.app.goo.gl/pztKwIPTrfwun8Jc2
>
> https://photos.app.goo.gl/0OHSpTCmuurpnacS2
>
> https://photos.app.goo.gl/Cv82THcYxKlLakNp2
>
> Once I got the hang of it, this actually worked well. You use your legs to
> operate it. I made a mark so I knew if I was turning the shaft 360º .
> String I used was a waxy type so doubled up, wrapped 3 times around input
> shaft, it gripped it quite well.
>
> Neil.
>
>
> On 10/4/17, Dennis Haynes <d23haynes57@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Where did those metal shavings come from? Looks more like aluminum
>> form the flywheel teeth hitting the bell housing. The bearings also
>> looks like it is a bit devoid of grease. If you can clean the shavings
>> out you are likely good to go.
>>
>> Dennis
>>
>>
>
>
>
> --
> Neil n
>
> Blog: Vanagons, Westfalia, general <http://tubaneil.blogspot.ca>
>
> 1988 Westy Images <https://picasaweb.google.com/musomuso/New1988Westy>
>
> 1981 Westfalia "Jaco" Images, technical <http://tubaneil.googlepages.com/>
>
> Vanagon-Bus VAG Gas Engine Swap Group <http://tinyurl.com/khalbay>
>


-- 
Neil n

Blog: Vanagons, Westfalia, general <http://tubaneil.blogspot.ca>

1988 Westy Images <https://picasaweb.google.com/musomuso/New1988Westy>

1981 Westfalia "Jaco" Images, technical <http://tubaneil.googlepages.com/>

Vanagon-Bus VAG Gas Engine Swap Group <http://tinyurl.com/khalbay>