Date: Fri, 3 Nov 2017 17:26:15 -0700
Reply-To: David McNeely <davmcneely40@GMAIL.COM>
Sender: Vanagon Mailing List <vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com>
From: David McNeely <davmcneely40@GMAIL.COM>
Subject: Re: The Tire Replacement Manual
In-Reply-To: <CY4PR20MB13033435C8C57E1F3306A9F8A05D0@CY4PR20MB1303.namprd20.prod.outlook.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
Dennis, I too do not want to seem argumentative. Different tires serve
different folks needs. I seldom need to go fast, and indeed, prefer not
to. I do need to get to my back country locations, and feel confident that
I can do so with the tires I choose. I used to run Hankook RA08, and after
that the Nokian that was similar. Both were marketed in this country as
"trailer tires," though they were specifically built and sold for vans
elsewhere. All these tires fit the VW specifications for the Vanagon.
I really appreciate all the helpful information that you provide on the
list.
Dave
On Fri, Nov 3, 2017 at 12:08 PM, Dennis Haynes <d23haynes57@hotmail.com>
wrote:
> I hope I’m not coming across as arguing! No disagreement here, just trying
> to clarify some myths and offer opportunities.
>
> I am extremely familiar with the Vredestein Comtrac. I have one family
> running three sets! This is a very high quality tire. Unfortunately as of
> now they are not available state side and they may not be again. From
> experience both Nokian and Vredestein all weather or winter tires seem to
> become available early fall and when the stock is depleted you won’t see
> them until next fall.
>
>
>
> That said, this tire is what is often referred to as a “purpose built”
> tire. It is a commercial tire, designed to last, resist damage, and get the
> delivery vehicle to its destination no matter what. This construction does
> extremely well in urban settings and is often used for
> regional-intra/inter-city applications.
>
>
>
> What this tire is ’not’ is a performance or high traction rain tire. While
> the high void ratio and narrow width help to avoid hydroplaning and deep
> snow traction, this design combined with the need for higher inflation
> pressure reduces contact patch. The non-rib tread design also takes away
> from directional stability. It’s all about goals and compromises.
>
>
>
> Dennis
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> *From:* David McNeely [mailto:davmcneely40@gmail.com]
> *Sent:* Friday, November 3, 2017 12:00 PM
>
> *To:* Dennis Haynes <d23haynes57@hotmail.com>
> *Cc:* vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM
> *Subject:* Re: The Tire Replacement Manual
>
>
>
> Well, I have the Vredestein Comptrac all weather. It has the mountain
> snowflake symbol for winter capability. I also carry chains. So far I am
> happy with it. Would I prefer a U.S. made tire? If there were one like
> the Vredestein. I suppose "looks" is a matter of taste. My taste runs to
> practical. Ruining a tire, or more significantly, a wheel, while on a back
> road would not be my definition of a good day. We will have to agree to
> disagree on this matter.
>
>
>
> On Fri, Nov 3, 2017 at 6:45 AM, Dennis Haynes <d23haynes57@hotmail.com>
> wrote:
>
> The thought that lower profiles tires are more susceptible to damage is
> not always true. Yes, wrapping a 23 inch tire around a 20 inch wheel does
> not leave much room for impacts. That is vastly different than a 26+ inch
> tire over a 16 or 17 inch wheel.
>
> For your occasional off road adventures some of the newer tires designed
> for crossover utility vehicles could really improve the vehicles
> capabilities especially if you encounter soft dirt or mud. For me, I
> occasionally due New York to Florida runs in winter. I need winter
> capability including snow and ice.
>
>
>
> Of the later tires I was using the WRG3 and really liked them. I am not on
> the Toyo Celsius CUV. So far I am impressed with ride, wet weather traction
> and yes looks. Let’s see when winter comes. These are more favorably priced
> than the WRG3 and I also like that they are stamped made in USA. For the
> Vanagon though you need 17 inch wheels. I have been fitting 225/55-17 on
> 2WD and 235/55-17 On Syncros.
>
>
>
> Dennis
>
>
>
>
>
> *From:* David McNeely [mailto:davmcneely40@gmail.com]
> *Sent:* Thursday, November 02, 2017 5:02 PM
> *To:* Dennis Haynes <d23haynes57@hotmail.com>
> *Cc:* vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM
> *Subject:* Re: The Tire Replacement Manual
>
>
>
> Hmmm..... . Well, some of us do drive our campers the way they perform
> best, and that is not at the high speeds most folks seem to have adopted.
> My high speed for my camper is just over 60 mph on the highway. I take it
> onto back country roads, forest service and BLM roads that fit the point
> made in the manual that lower profile tires are much more subject to damage
> from road hazards than are higher profile tires. It is in fact the ability
> to navigate such roads and to camp in isolation from those who prefer
> developed camp grounds that make the vehicle useful to me.
>
> I realize that the beast has limitations that "modern" drivers dislike.
> It has capabilities that I prefer, including high clearance and capability
> on rough roads. This summer I drove on a Forest Service road that required
> 3 hours to traverse 11 miles. My camper is not a Synchro. I just drove
> very slowly and carefully, easing around washouts and boulders that would
> simply stop most folks who would rather have a "higher performing" vehicle,
> with less tire sidewall. I don't have my camper in order to go fast or to
> take corners at breakneck speeds.
>
>
>
> On Thu, Nov 2, 2017 at 11:55 AM, Dennis Haynes <d23haynes57@hotmail.com>
> wrote:
>
> The load index table should also be available form the tire manufacturer.
> Your dealer should be able to supply this for you. As for that tire not
> being listed due to obsolescence keep in mind this document is already 11
> years old.
>
> For replacement the 195/75-14 is the correct diameter to replace a
> 185/80-14. As for changing OEM specifications consider the OEM lead in this
> case. Beginning with the 87 model year the 205/70-14XL was the OEM supplied
> upgrade. Then there was the move to 15 inch wheels to make room for brakes
> and other needs on the Eurovan. The last of the Eurovans were fitted with
> 225/60-XL. See a correlation to my recommendations?
>
>
>
> Tire technology has changed and so has our driving speeds. When our vans
> were designed-built we had a 55 mph speed limit. Few of us travel at 55 or
> less. We didn't always back then! Getting into the newer tire sizes also
> gets us some of these newer capabilities. Skinny tires running at high
> inflation pressures leave you with reduced contact patches and an impact
> sensitive ride. Think of those non pneumatic tires on your first bicycle or
> trike. The Vanagon ahs the benefit of a well designed independent
> suspension with tires being the major limiting factor. There is room for
> improvement here, but it has to be done correctly.
>
>
>
> Dennis
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> *From:* David McNeely <davmcneely40@gmail.com>
> *Sent:* Thursday, November 2, 2017 12:44 AM
> *To:* Dennis Haynes
> *Cc:* vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM
> *Subject:* Re: The Tire Replacement Manual
>
>
>
> Dennis, thanks for providing this. It clarifies a lot. However, I notice
> that the OE tire sizes for our campers are not included in the tables. I
> suppose, like has been observed many times on this list, that the tire size
> being considered by most manufacturers as "obsolete" is the reason. But
> our vehicles are real, and we drive them. Are you aware of a source that
> provides similar data for our OE tire sizes? The nearest size in the
> attached document is LT185/75R14, but of course, the aspect ratio is too
> low, and the tire diameter would be too small. The OE tire size of
> LT185R14 has an aspect ratio of approximately 82 as I understand it. The
> alternate size of LT195R14 of course has the same aspect ratio, and is only
> very slightly larger in diameter.
>
> The document does reinforce my notion that one should just stick with OE
> specifications up until that becomes literally impossible. For now, there
> are still tires available that fit that bill, though not very many choices.
>
>
>
> On Mon, Oct 30, 2017 at 6:18 PM, Dennis Haynes <d23haynes57@hotmail.com>
> wrote:
>
> For all the recent questions I once again would like to point out this
> reference guide.
>
> http://www.tiresafety.com/images/Tire%20Replacement%20Manual.pdf
> <https://eur01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.tiresafety.com%2Fimages%2FTire%2520Replacement%2520Manual.pdf&data=02%7C01%7Cd23haynes57%40hotmail.com%7C148a77a8539b450c346408d521ac83c7%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C636451947182908333&sdata=om%2Fd4%2BnRWAYAbh%2FoV2yXRBvYWgOeLhIrsgrTNkin7aI%3D&reserved=0>
>
> While is now 11 years old, this is probably the best tire reference manual
> with the most important information in one place, in a format that is easy
> to understand.
> Of most benefit is the load-inflation tables for most every size tire we
> would consider. There is some good reading in here. I will be referenicing
> this manual occasionally in some of my responses to posted questions.
>
> Dennis
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
| 
