Date: Sun, 7 Feb 2021 20:25:00 -0800
Reply-To: Dan N <dn92610@GMAIL.COM>
Sender: Vanagon Mailing List <vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com>
From: Dan N <dn92610@GMAIL.COM>
Subject: Re: FW: Vanagon engineering some different perspectives.
In-Reply-To: <CY4PR0801MB3731FDDFB388CF64EB365B91A0B09@CY4PR0801MB3731.namprd08.prod.outlook.com>
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Thank you Dennis...
it's very very well written... I really enjoy reading it...
dan
On Sun, Feb 7, 2021 at 9:33 AM Dennis Haynes <d23haynes57@hotmail.com>
wrote:
> From: Dennis Haynes
> Sent: Sunday, February 7, 2021 12:32 PM
> To: vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM
> Subject: Vanagon engineering some different perspectives.
>
> I was looking to make this a Friday post but just different have the time.
> I started paying attention to cars at a young age and can recall my father
> taking driving lessons while I was in kindergarten. Both my parents came
> from the Housing projects of Canarsie andmy father was the first to drive
> and own a car. Both my grandfathers never drove. After my dad become mobile
> we moved from Brooklyn to Long Island. My father's mom learn to drive
> shortly afterwards so they could visit. My mom's mother learnt driv e after
> they moved to Florida (1977) and found they had no choice.
>
> Our first cars was 1961 Ford Falcon. After the move it didn't last long
> and was replaced with a new Mercury Comet. Barley lasted 3 years and was
> replaced with a Ford Torino Station Wagon. Dad was very proud of that car.
> The V8 engine and "Power Disc Brakes", fully noted on the brake pedal. Oh
> and that fancy rear tailgate with the two hinges and power window. Mom
> working two jobs while 7 months pregnant fell asleep driving and that meet
> its demise hitting a telephone pole. She escaped with minor injury.
>
> The replacement for the wagon was 1971 Beetle. That was our only car as we
> became a family of 6. The following summer the 6 of us did a Labor day
> vacation in Lake George. A few weeks after that we became a 2 car family, a
> Blue-White 67 Bus. For me the path was set. These 2 cars would become my
> training. My dad had absolutely no technical skills but my mom was willing
> and supportive to let me learn. Another book!
> Anyway before I had a learners permit the Bus needed engine work again. No
> money to get it fixed mom let me try. With a minimal set of tools including
> a cheap scissor jack the engine came out. Set on top of an upside down
> garbage can I replaced the heads and piston/cylinders. The "Big Bore" set
> going from 1,500 cc to 1,679 cc. Of course not knowing about torque
> wrenches and other needed skills loose heads and pulled studs occurred so I
> did get some practice over the next few years. In 1978 my parents upped
> things to a small motorhome and I bought the Bus from them. As it rusted a
> part it was sold and then replaced with a '70, 72' (First Fun Bus and
> honeymoon Bus). Then we went to an 84 Vanagon. While we other VWs along the
> way the 84 was replaced with the 1987 Syncro Westy which we still have with
> 354K on the clock.
>
> As side thought my mom suggested that I don't pursue the automotive repair
> career path. "Car mechanics are plentiful, and no one likes them". Not her
> exact words. But she suggested that I seek a career in industrial
> maintenance. Having worked for many years in factories, sometimes two jobs
> she new that industrial mechanics were in short supply and typically paid
> well. Between my Junior and Senior year in high school she got me job in
> the "Record Factory" Remember them? So that set my path there.
>
> As for engineering and reliability while I have done a number of roadside
> repairs Fun Bus has only been towed home twice and both were for electrical
> failures. Once an ignition coil and the other event the ECU failing and
> filling the engine with fuel. For on trip mechanical failures besides water
> pumps, hoses, pipes, belts, etc. the transmission is the weak link.
>
> Looking at engineering philosophies for both automotive and industrial
> there are a number of different approaches to all things in general.
> Aviation and Space things aside here are my Dennis isms.
>
> American, design things large enough and stout to reliably get past the
> design life and be tolerant of abuse. Plan for "What if Failures".
> European, design to just get the job done, prove by testing. Maintenance
> is the ongoing cost of ownership. If a part id there it is needed, even if
> just for appearance. Keep adding parts to get it to what is needed.
> Asian, parts of the above but unexpected failure is not an option.
> Everything has to work as one.
>
> So getting back to the Vanagon. As part f European engineering we should
> also look at history. The first busses were almost not much more than a
> beetle turned into a box. The minimalistic and cost saving approach follows
> VW to this day. Updates and improvements are done in small bay steps and
> not until there is no choice. I can give some many examples from tires and
> wheels to door latches and even body design. How did we get fuel injection
> in 1975 and still use points? How about in 68 the Beetles and other
> vehicles got the rims with the safety "J" bead but the busses didn't get
> them until 71 with the addition of front discs and brake booster. And for
> 73 the brakes were changed again for thicker pads up front. Those brakes
> were used up until 85!
>
> As for the Water boxer this is probably the result of a number of things
> including for its day this is amongst the larger displacement engines VW
> had available. Emissions compliance was probably also a major concern. From
> lessons learned of air cooled failures. I am at a loss as to why some many
> dimensions were type 1 based instead of the later type 4 motors. Bit
> overall this is really a great engine except for a few weaknesses. The head
> studs could be more robust. Except for cracked heads combustion gasses
> getting into the cooling system always begin with the heads coming loose
> causing the seal to fail at the top of the cylinder. The can also allow
> coolant into the oil at the base of the cylinder. Add the other gasket
> design. I would think a different material or design could eliminate this
> failure mode. As the design of replaceable cylinders in a jacket this is
> common for many large truck and industrial engines. Engines with the bores
> in block, often called "parent bore" are generally considered replaceable
> or consumable engines. There are also thermal advantages to designs where
> entire cylinder is submersed and exposed to the coolant. Large engines in
> buildings and ships often are in place before the structures are built
> around so it is important that anything that can wear or be damaged in
> replaceable "In Frame". For the Vanagon the since the pistons and valves
> are exposed to the combustion process they should typically be the wear
> items that need service. The bottom end with some TLC should last almost
> forever. I usually change the heads and rings engine in place. Last is oil
> temperature. Some will debate this. High oil temp can reduce engine life in
> a number of ways. When are vans were sold the national speed limit was 55
> mph and for that speed the 2.1 cooling system works well usually keeping
> the oil under 220F. Out of control as temps raise oil pressure goes down.
> Hot oil also reduces piston cooling which can add to engine knocking. Keep
> the oil cool and clean and the bottom end will not fail.
>
> This can sort of go on forever and I'm not that good at writing. Do much
> better at answering questions than throwing stuff out there. So if I can be
> of more help, ask! Many of started with Vanagons as part of this dream of a
> low cost travel vehicles. Many of use have become a victim of "VW turning
> drivers into mechanics" for decades. For me a goal is to keep what you have
> going. I focus on adding value. As much as I have enjoyed driving a
> customers GW 2.7 when the day comes for Fun Bus I'm still thinking that
> even after 354K slapping on a set of heads and eight rings or P/C set will
> keep it going at far less cost than any engine upgrade or conversion. The
> big investment it needs now is rust repair and paint job #3.
>
> Dennis
>
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