Date: Thu, 20 Apr 1995 23:40:58 -0400 (EDT)
Sender: Vanagon Mailing List <vanagon@vanagon.com>
From: Terry Tan <terrytan@ritz.mordor.com>
Subject: Re: FTC, VWOA, Head Replacement Questions
>
> >I volunteer to archive the composite tales of woe/terror/ripoff/etc=
> regarding
> >head replacement, leaking seals, etc. =20
> >
> >If we gather the info correctly we will have a strong case for presenting
> >VWOA with either a "make it right via FTC" or a potential Class Action=
> lawsuit.
>
> Wow. Great idea.=20
>
Derek,
I support your efforts.
I hate to see class action suits against mfr especially litigations
that result from greed or frivolous matters but my experience with VW
shows that the individuals within the company that were involved had never
learned from their snob attitude during the handling of the Audi 5000 case
which costs VW dearly.
Unfortunately because of the decision of a handful of executives within
the Corporate structure the company suffers financial damage that affects
all the workers within that organization.
Perhaps action like this will weed out those individuals within that
company and thereby set an example for other companies to follow.
Enterprises like VW must relearn that providing a good product to the
consumer must be their ultimate goal. The profits will fall in line
if this law is followed faithfully. If you make a mistake especially
if some dumb engineer within screw up on the design make the correction
immediately. Dont start using the army of corporate attorneys within
to cover up. It will evetually cost you more.
Lets face it, if these lawyers were of real calibre, they will be
practicing on their own and not for somebody.
A very large corporation that I used to worked for(sorry will not identify
it) followed this basic rule and eventually became one of the world's
largest and profitable company. Not too long ago it too deviated from the
principles laid down by its founder and paid a hefty price for its
decision.
> Here is a reproduction of a private message I just
sent off to one of our > list members.
>
> Derek
>
>
> >Derek: We have an '85 Westy that was given to us by my inlaws 2 years=20
> >ago, Do you know if we would be covered since we aren't the original=20
> >purchasers under this? We apparently have a colent leak at the head=20
> >gasket. Also. how do you go about filing to have this done? And do you=20
> >need complete service records from when the vehice was purchased? Thanks=
> =20
> >for the info!!!!
>
> In the event that there is paperwork or other signs that the car has more
> than 50,000 miles on it, then:=20
>
> 1. Ask that a DSM look at the car and see what he will offer you in the way
> of "assistance."
>
> 2. If you want to get more "assistance" then go through the FTC process.
> Your case is really iron clad since this is a fault of VWs and everybody has
> it. You need to prove this by going to the archive of the vanagon list and
> downloading all the tales of woe.
>
> The fact that your car was obtained used is irrevelant here and nobody is
> likely to even mention it to you.
>
> Here is the FTC infomration:=20
>
> I found this today on the Federal Trade Comission site. It appears to mean
> that we can all go mob VW to pay for all our engine repairs *even if we have
> already paid for those repairs!*
>
> That is, I bet the collective expense among members of this list for engine
> repairs is in the multi millions of dollars over the years. Apparently, this
> thing gives us the right to go to the BBB and try to get VW to refund to us
> the amount we spent in the past, even for VWs sold in the 1970s. It costs
> us nothing and it could be a bonanza.
>
> I bet nobody on the list has ever taken advantage of this program but it is
> hanging right out there.=20
>
> Enjoy. I wonder if any of us has the initiative to actually take advantage
> of this. Anyone who had a leaking head gasket seal would be a prime
> candidate. If you had more than 50,000 miles on your engine, VW billed you
> for part of the repair. But one could argue that they should have set the
> threshhold higher, say, at 100,000 miles.
>
> Derek Drew
> 90 Syncro Westy
>
> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
> Facts for Consumers from the Federal Trade Commission
>
> VW Mediation/ Arbitration Program -- July 1994
>
>
> Under the terms of a 1988 Federal Trade Commission
> order, Volkswagen of America (VWoA) has established a
> mediation/arbitration program for all owners and lessees of
> VWoA or Audi cars and light trucks with engine problems.
> Through this informal program, operated by the Better
> Business Bureau (BBB), you may seek one of the following
> settlements: a refund for the money you spent on repairs;
> repairs to be made by VWoA at no charge to you; or a VWoA
> buy-back of your car.
>
> To participate, you must contact the nearest BBB or
> VWoA and request an arbitration package that includes, among
> other things, a settlement request form, which you must
> complete and return. The BBB toll-free number is
> 1-800-955-5100. You can contact VWoA by writing:
>
> Volkswagen of America, Inc.
> Customer Services Department
> 888 West Big Beaver
> P.O. Box 3951
> Troy, MI 48007-3951
>
> or by calling:
> #1-800-822-8987 (VWoA owners)
> #1-800-822-2834 (Audi owners)
>
> This arbitration program covers two categories of
> problems -- specified claims and internal engine component
> claims.
>
> Specified claims can be filed by owners or lessees who
> experienced oil consumption-related problems in water-cooled
> gasoline engine Volkswagen and Audi vehicles from model
> years 1974 through 1979. If you have had such oil
> consumption problems, you need not still own or lease the
> car to be eligible to participate in the program.
>
> Internal engine component claims involve all other
> engine problems. All owners or lessees who experienced
> internal engine component problems with any Volkswagen or
> Audi vehicle, regardless of the model year and engine type,
> can file claims. However, you still must own or lease your
> car to be eligible.
>
> Mediation
>
> The arbitration program, which is offered to you at no
> charge, has two phases: mediation and arbitration. First,
> the BBB will try to mediate a settlement between you and
> VWoA without having an arbitration hearing. For example, BBB
> staff may ask you to talk to the dealer one more time. Or
> they may suggest that you contact your VWoA regional office
> about your problem. Sometimes, the BBB talks to each party
> and tries to arrange a settlement. This mediation process
> may result in VWoA making an offer that satisfies you.
>
> If you accept the VWoA offer, you give up your right to
> arbitrate this particular problem (unless the problem
> happens again, of course). If you are not satisfied with the
> VWoA offer, you have the right to an arbitration hearing.
> Make sure you notify the BBB if you want to have a hearing.
> Keep a record of the date you contacted the office.
>
> Arbitration
>
> Arbitration is the next step when mediation fails. It
> differs from mediation in that the parties do not settle the
> problem between themselves. They present their claims to an
> impartial third party called the arbitrator, who is the
> decision maker.
>
> Arbitration is informal; you do not need a lawyer and
> there are no complicated legal rules. The arbitrator listens
> to both sides, asks questions, and ultimately makes a
> decision that he or she believes is fair. The arbitrator may
> decide for or against your claim. You do not have to accept
> the arbitrator's decision (see page 7). However, VWoA must
> accept the arbitrator's decision as final if it's accepted
> by you. If you decide to arbitrate, your local BBB will give
> you further explanations about the program's rules.
>
> The Award Request
>
> On your arbitration form, you will be asked to state
> exactly what you want to receive from VWoA through the
> arbitration process. If you already have had your car
> repaired, you may wish to ask for the amount of your bill.
> If your car has not been repaired, you may wish to ask the
> arbitrator to order VWoA to make the repairs at no charge to
> you. Or, if your case justifies it, you might ask for a
> combination of these.
>
> You are eligible to file a claim and have an
> arbitration hearing regardless of your vehicle's age or
> mileage. However, age and mileage are factors that can be
> taken into consideration by the arbitrator in arriving at a
> decision.
>
> In an extraordinary case -- for example, if the dealer
> has been unable to fix serious problems with the car after
> several tries -- you may wish to ask the arbitrator to order
> VWoA to buy back the car. In this case, VWoA may ask the
> arbitrator to deduct an amount from the cost of the car for
> mileage or use. The arbitrator does not have to make any
> deduction from the award, but may do so based on individual
> circumstances. The arbitrator cannot give you more than you
> have asked for on the award request.
>
> The Arbitrator
>
> Arbitrators are community volunteers whom the BBB has
> recruited and trained. VWoA does not take part in selecting
> an arbitrator. An arbitrator is never paid, except for
> occasional travel expenses.
>
> If you live far from the BBB office, the staff will try
> to arrange a hearing location closer to your home. Once the
> arbitrator is appointed, the BBB will set a date for the
> hearing.
>
> The Arbitration Hearing
>
> The arbitration hearing is an informal proceeding where
> you have an opportunity to tell your story. You can present
> any documents and witnesses you want. Essentially, you have
> to convince the arbitrator that what you are asking is fair.
>
> VWoA will have the same opportunity. If necessary, the
> arbitrator may decide to ask the BBB to supply and pay for
> an expert, or you can bring, at your expense, your own
> expert -- for example, the mechanic who worked on your car.
> You do not need a lawyer.
>
> Preparing for an Arbitration Hearing
>
> A key factor in the outcome of arbitration is
> preparation. If you are well-organized, your case will be
> easier for the arbitrator to understand.
>
> Documents, such as receipts for car maintenance and
> repair, are usually the best type of information to present
> at the hearing. But letters from anyone who is familiar with
> the details, such as the mechanic who repaired the car, are
> good substitutes. At the hearing, of course, you or others
> can tell the arbitrator about any relevant details, even if
> you do not have documents.
>
> Repair Information. You should list all of the details
> about the car and each problem for which you are seeking a
> refund or repair:
>
> * the identification of the car by VIN (Vehicle
> Identification Number);
>
> * the make, model, and year;
>
> * the mileage on the car;
>
> * the date(s) of any repair(s) and the mileage at which
> any repair(s) were made;
>
> * the car part(s) that were repaired;
>
> * the cost(s) of any repair(s); and
>
> * if repairs were paid, some indication that you (rather
> than someone else) paid the bill(s).
>
> As suggested above, a receipt often can show much of
> the necessary information. If you no longer have a receipt,
> you can ask your mechanic for a copy of the repair record or
> ask the repair mechanic to come to your hearing or write a
> letter. In reporting information, the mechanic should
> include:
>
> * what was wrong with the car;
>
> * what caused the failure; and
>
> * if you have properly maintained your car.
>
> If the repair work has not yet been done, an estimate
> or work order providing such information would be important.
>
> If you no longer own the vehicle but are arbitrating an
> oil consumption-related problem covered by the specified
> claims program, you should have proof of past ownership for
> your arbitration hearing, such as a copy of the title,
> registration, an insurance policy, a purchase contract, or
> financing documents. The repair receipt itself may show
> ownership, as well as the necessary repair information.
>
> Maintenance and Driving Habits
>
> VWoA may argue at the hearing that your problem was
> caused by poor maintenance or improper driving habits. If
> you can show that you followed the recommended maintenance
> schedule and that you avoided driving practices the owner's
> manual cautions against, you have a better chance of
> winning. For example, if the problem involves an internal
> engine part such as a camshaft, it would be helpful to show
> that you changed the engine oil at the recommended intervals
> for the type of driving you do and that you used the type of
> oil recommended in the owner's manual.
>
> To demonstrate maintenance, written records -- such as
> receipts, door stickers, or personal notes -- usually are=7F=7F
> the best. On the other hand, to show proper driving
> practices, your statements to the arbitrator may be the only
> evidence possible.
>
> Other Information
>
> Sometimes, showing the arbitrator that others have had
> similar car failures can help indicate that the problem was
> with the car rather than with your maintenance or driving
> habits. For example, your mechanic may know of similar
> failures; you may have seen (or be able to find) articles
> about similar problems in your local newspaper or in car
> magazines (check columns written by expert mechanics); and
> your state or city consumer protection offices may be aware
> of others with similar car problems or may have additional
> information.
>
> Also, VWoA sends service bulletins about certain
> problems to its dealers. Although many service bulletins
> simply update the dealers about changes in part numbers,
> other bulletins may indicate that your car repair was a
> common problem. Therefore, if you can obtain a copy of an
> appropriate service bulletin and find a mechanic who will
> verify that the bulletin applies to your car problem, you
> might want to show it to the arbitrator.
>
> For information about how to order some or all of the
> bulletins that may apply to your car, call 1-800-544-8021.
> You also may be able to look at copies of the bulletins at
> local VWoA dealers.
>
> If your complaint involves an oil consumption-related
> problem in a 1974 through 1979 water-cooled gasoline engine
> VW or Audi vehicle, when you receive your specified claims
> arbitration forms, you also will get "background statements"
> prepared by the FTC and VWoA. You can present these
> statements to the arbitrator. They may help the arbitrator
> reach a decision.
>
> The Arbitrator's Decision
>
> Usually a few days after the hearing, the arbitrator
> will write a decision, called an "award." It is binding on
> VWoA, but not on you. You can accept or reject it. If you
> accept the award, VWoA must do what the arbitrator decides.
> For example, you might ask for $700 but only be awarded $500
> by the arbitrator. You can accept the $500 award, which ends=7F
> your claim, or you can reject the $500 award and pursue your
> case through other avenues, such as a small claims court.
>
> If you have problems or questions about the arbitration
> program, contact your local BBB or the FTC at any of their
> offices listed on the next page.
>
> For a list of all the FTC's free consumer and business
> publications, contact: Public Reference, Federal Trade
> Commission, Washington, DC 20580; 202-326-2222. TTY (202)
> 326-2502. Ask for a copy of Best Sellers.=7F=7F
>
> 6/88; 8/89
> .
> =20
> ___________________________________
> Derek Drew
> drew@interport.net (main address for e-mail)
> derekdrew@aol.com (alternate/backup address, checked infrequently)=20
>
>
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