Date: Sun, 6 Oct 1996 20:42:57 -0400
Sender: Vanagon Mailing List <vanagon@vanagon.com>
From: j.ettorre@utoronto.ca
Subject: Re: Super-technical question
On Sun, 6 Oct 1996, Tim Smith wrote:
> Them's fightin' words varmint.....
>
>
> >> GEEk.... This has got to be some project for school! Anyone in school
> >> is a GEEK!
> >>
> >> ERIC
> >You're right. It is a project for school. It's an industrial validation
> >test station that VW will be using in their plant. I hope that makes you
> >feel more secure.
> >
> >What is this crap?? Eric, if you're 14 years old I can understand this,
> >but you're obviously not. I dont care who you are or what you do, but
> >keep this crap off the list.
>
>
> Looks like someones a bit sensitive about geekdom, good shot Eric :)
>
> If you took Erics comment really seriously, lighten up, he's outnumbered
> millions to one.
Uh, I kind of thought everyone with an internet account was a geek, but I
really didnt want to say it.
>
> If you want the modulus for steel in order to assess the influence of the
> steel studs upon the elastic elongation/compression of the waterjacket
> assembly when torqued and need the EXACT value I can see you are going to
> make a mountain out of nothing. Have you got the EXACT thermal coefficients
> of expansion for the jacket alloy, and the case too, and have you worked out
> the temperature gradients throughout the jacket/case at all operating
> conditions so you can accurately assess the thermal growth that will occur?
> Do you have the modulus for the thick head gasket, and Poissons ratio for
> it? How about for an aged and stiffened up gasket? A cold gasket?
>
What I'm really trying to do is use strain gauges to measure the strain,
then find the load P in these studs with Young's modulus at room
temperature. There's not that much to this, but there is variation in E
between steels. This type is "high-strength", which tells me almost
nothing. I'm obviously going to overdesign a bit but Id like a reaslistic
starting point. This also may have an impact on the equipment to specify,
which influences cost, setup, etc... In the test that was done I used
E=28*10^6psi as a guess. This gave me 4000lbf in each stud, for a grand
total of 32 tons of force. Hmmm.
> I wouldn't even worry about Youngs modulus until some of that stuff is
> answered. Have you 'built' a numerical/FEM model of this system. ANSYS
> will do thermal/heat transfer cases, surely VW can provide the EXACT
> geometry of the components from their CAD drawings? Have you done a
He had no CAD drawings, sadly. The drawings I have are a cutaway engine
and a cutaway cylinder head detail, which are limited in use but make
great posters, in case you were wondering. I'm not going to get anymore
drawings, by the way. Luckily, there isn't really a need for this much
abstraction.
> parametric study to see what the influence of a few percent error in Youngs
> modulus will do to the outcome? Steel is steel, or ask VW then go get Marks
> handbook or similar and look it up.
>
> As a graduate of Waterloo University, Canadas top engineering school, I
No, that's not true.
> will be very interested to see what U of T and VW can do when teamed up to
> work on a discontinued engine that was a disaster on the VW design boards,
> thanks to short sighted engineering in the first place. It's too late to
> recover, don't VW realize that? Since they refused to fix any of the three
> (3) bad engines I've had, f*ck'em!
They realize this. Everything you've suggested is an excellent way to
design a NEW engine, but the intent here is to catch any bad parts before
they have a chance to reach the customer. Car and Driver link the
development of the Wasserboxer to the Porsce 935 race car with
water-cooled heads. Believe it or not!
>
> Finally, don't bite the hand that feeds you, lest it wring your (pencil)
> neck! More expertise on this list than you will find at an engine rebuild
> plant. Obviously no enginerring since you wouldn't be asking us for that
> data, right?!!. Finally, since 9T6 stands for the year of your intended
> graduation from UofT, presumably LAST April, does the +P stand for 'plus
> Plan' where you keep going and going and going..... ;>.
The P is for Professinal Experience Year. This means I left school for a
year to work in industry (Magna) as a co-op work term. Employers prefer
this system to 4*4 month interships, Tim. This is a fantastic idea that
all students should pursue, not because Waterloo didn't let me into Mech,
but because the experience, contacts, and resume-stuffing potential are
enormous. To all you students out there, who cares if it takes another year?
School is more fun than work (I still miss my weekends).
>
> bye, tim smith
>
>
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