Date:         Mon, 31 Mar 97 05:09:46 UT
Sender:       Vanagon Mailing List <vanagon@vanagon.com>
From:         "Dennis Haynes" <dhaynes57@msn.com>
Subject:      RE: Upgraded Brakes Bus/Vanagon?

I would not consider 914 Brakes to be an upgrade for a Vanagon.  Although 
there may be some clamping force advantage, there is no more rotor surface to 
provide friction or dissipate heat.  Since you have an 85,  a real easy 
conversion would be to install the spindle set up from an 86 or later.  The 
pads are much larger and the caliper is now a single piston.  The rotors are 
increased in thickness from 13 to 15 mm.  Note that you can only cut 2mm total 
off these rotors before they are scraps.  I find that this means one cut if 
you are lucky.  When purchasing pads and shoes, see your dealer.  I have found 
that all after market either wear out too fast or they do not have enough 
friction which means increased pedal effort and more heat to warp and wear the 
rotors.  Note the factory fitt-ment for the rears are now metallic. The 
diameter of the rear drums is very critical.  An oversize drum will cause a 
poor contact pattern between the shoes and drums resulting in less than ideal 
braking.  Since the cylinders and the adjusters are both at the top of the 
shoes,  only the tops get worn.  I space out the bottom shoe rests with shims 
to compensate for this design flaw.  9/16 external snap rings work great for 
this purpose.  With new shoes and rotors, you can still fit three of these 
shims on each side.   I hope this helps.

Dennis

-----Original Message-----
>From:	vanagon@lenti.med.umn.edu  On Behalf Of vwbus@netbiz.net
Sent:	Thursday, March 27, 1997 12:23 AM
To:	Multiple recipients of list
Subject:	Upgraded Brakes Bus/Vanagon?

An article this month in Euro Car got my mind wondering a little bit, 
no one is going to argue I'm sure that late Bus and Vanagon brakes 
could not use a little upgrading, well the article details a cheap 
upgrade to Porsche 914 brakes instead.  The 914 uses an ATE caliper 
very much similar to the Vanagon, the primary difference with the Bus 
being the inlet of the hydraulic pipe.  Now the upgrade is the fact 
that early BMW 3 series calipers are a direct bolt on replacement for 
earlier 914's and fit with slight machining for offset on late 914's. 
The interesting thing is that even though the caliper is much larger 
physically with a larger piston for greater hydraulic advantage and 
larger pads, the mounting holes line up, so why not maybe the same 
mounting on Buses and Vanagons I wonder.  Anyway the '85 needs new 
calipers anyway, the 914 and 3 series used 14"? or 15"? wheels so the disc 
size may have been similar as may be the mounting pattern and offset, 
as the 914 seemed to use the hub integral in disc system like a bus, 
hence again maybe offset OK as well and slight machining or spacers 
not much of a problem anyway.  Anyone with a 914 want to help or 
conjecture?  I think I'm going to go looking for a junkyard 3 series 
caliper to find out anyway.  A little more clamping force and fade 
resistance would be real nice for a Van particularly, now the Bus 
install would require a bit of piping changes.  Anyway may not even 
be worth it, I'm going to look tomorrow at the size of the pistons in 
the Bus/Van calipers as the "upgrade" size was listed in the article 
but slips my mind here.

John
vwbus@netbiz.net