Date:         Sat, 19 Jul 1997 06:34:20 -0400
Sender:       Vanagon Mailing List <vanagon@vanagon.com>
From:         mark keller <kelphoto@BRIGHT.NET>
Subject:      Re: A/C parts and service Advice

Dear Sir

I just disconnected my a/c condensor lines, so I'll share my experiences.

1. When breaking the nuts loose always use a second wrench to take the
strain from the sytem. That is don't just use one wrench to loosen a
connection. Get another wrench and "hold" the connection, while you apply
torque to loosen the nut.

2. Flushing the system is done by the A/C shop, normally nitrogen or
whatever is used to Flush the system.  Not all shops who recharge can
"flush" the system so a little phone research will ensure this. BTW ask the
cost over the phone, sometimes they'll give a better price to someone who
is "shopping around"

3.  First you dont need to drop the rad or the evap.  Drop the spare and
the lines will be on the driver's side, and bottom of the cond core.

Please note it is a good Idea to plug the system connections on both ends
when you separate them-- in practice it's not always needed, when the
vehicle is being repair same day and not being driven ie a shop situation.

Double check that the "radiator shop" is doing the repair, and not just
sending the hose across town to be done by someone else.  Do a little
research, you may be able to find these guys under "hydraulic Hose" in the
Yellow pages. The hose repair shop, should have a supply of plugs.  I've
put a plastic baggy over the end and secured w/ a rubber band.

On the hose replacement. Three bad hoses sounds bizarre-- unless your ran
over your lawnmower whilst is was a runnin!  This system utilizes o-rings,
to seal the upfront connections, I suspect they are in the rear too.
O-rings are the first thing to replace, and are the primary leak point.
Since oil is in the freon, a leak can be confirmed by an oily/grimy area on
the hose at the leak area. Again typically the leaks occur around the
O-ring seals. There are places that specialize in O-rings and they can
match you up, if other local sources fail to. The hydralic repair people
may be able to refer you if they don't have em. BTW way it'll help if you
can tell them what type of material your o ring should be made of. Viton,
or neoprene, etc. A phone call around can help. REMEMBER your saving $1500,
that's a lot of my time. Especially when you consider that's after taxes.

My experience on hose repairs  cost is, so much  per foot, crimping and
fixing was included in the hose per foot cost, they'll use your "fittings"
This is a good way to repair a hose.  There are several hoses that will
suffice to repair your system, I'd try for the nitrile stuff, since Messr.
McGee's research I believe said that for later conversion to 134, it was a
perferred choice. Personally I wouldn't get to exercised about replacing
every hose. Just do good solid repairs on what's broke. Make sure it's
broke though.

Dealers are notourious liers. Some children do also. It's not the end of
the world, but when a dealer fibbs, it can really rock your emotions, cause
they are like mummy and daddy in our feeble minds. I mean are intution is
to say "well they are supposed to be the experts:"  I've got to say that
when a dealer says something is broken, the only response I make is. OK
note it on my repair bill and I'll look in to it.

I was having my 240Z serviced for a new xsmn mount. I got a call at work,
by a "worried" service writer, who was just informed by the mechanic that
the "altenator belt was cut nearly slap in two, and the brake pads were
shot." The semi metallic pads were less than half, which means I got 30K
miles MORE out of em, . The belt lasted, and wasn't cut or anything, 5 or 6
years. I maintain the thing so I knew this.  Moral Dealers as a rule of
thumb need to be treated more like kids-- the neighbors kids-- than
parental authority we it comes to receiving information about your car.

Sincerely

Mark Keller
91 Carat WLE



>Friends,
>
>I need advice on servicing my A/C system.   I have never done any A/C work
>before other than tearing a system or two out many years ago.  Anyways I
>had my 90 Multivan into my local VW dealer to hopefully just have the A/C
>system recharged since the system was just barely cooling the passenger
>area and not nearly working as good as last summer.  The bad news is when
>they called me back they said I needed three A/C hoses and the
>reciever/dryer replaced to the tune of about $1500 for parts and $400 for
>labor.  I said thank you very much but know way am I able to sink that kind
>of money into the A/C which we use for about 2 or 3 monthes here in
>Wisconsin.  The dealer discharged the system of freon and here I am asking
>for advice on how to fix this thing.
>
>The good news first, the compressor, evaporator, expansion valve, and
>condensor are all in good condition.  The reciever dryer is ok too except
>the mechanic at the dealer said he wasn't sure the hoses would come easily
>off the reciever dryer so he wanted to replace that as well.
>
>The bad news is the A/C hoses are a dealer only item.  I called around and
>thanks to Europarts and Bobs Auto Parts (Limbo member) they both
>recommended I contact a shop in my area and have these hoses made.  Well I
>did and I found two radiator shops in my town that said they can do this
>but that I would have to bring in the old hoses, they will most likely take
>the fittings off my old ones and recrimp them onto new hoses.
>
>This is were my questions start:
>
>1.  Once I remove these hoses from my van are their any plugs that you can
>buy to plug the holes left open from disconnected the hose.  Apparently you
>want to keep dirt and moisture out of these components (compressor,
>condensor, ecvaporator).
>
>2.  Would it be a good idea to flush the condensor and evaporator at this
>time?  I guess this is an option for me at this point, but it would be a
>definite requirement if the compressor was blown.   Am I right about this?
>
>3.  Bentley does not really go into much explanation regarding the removal
>of A/C line from the condensor, but my question is will I have to drop the
>radiator and condensor at the same time to disconnent the A/C hoses from
>the condensor.
>
>4.  If any of the fittings on the ends of the hoses are bad or I ruin them
>when I take them off does anyone know if these fitting are available like
>from a parts store or radiator shop.
>
>5.  Can I drive my van if the hoses are removed but the holes that are left
>are properly plugged?  I dont anticipate having to drive it once I remove
>these hoses but its just some thing I was wondering about.
>
>6.  Last question is has anyone had hoses made like this, the dealer prices
>are like exponetially high.
>
>I have considered just letting the whole A/C go and not fix it but I find
>this hard to do since the rest of the van is very well maintained.
>
>Tim Marciniak
>90 Multivan