Date:         Wed, 11 Aug 1999 10:50:24 -0400
Reply-To:     Noto-Gaudette <derwin@NET1PLUS.COM>
Sender:       Vanagon Mailing List <vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com>
From:         Noto-Gaudette <derwin@NET1PLUS.COM>
Subject:      Re: Propane (East Coast)
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii

To weigh in on purging--

Thanks for the good advice, Bulley. I disagree only with the statement
that the tank must be purged *each time* it is "completely empty"--I
don't want people to think they should purge every time they fill if
they have good LP usage habits.

My meager qualifications and disclaimer: although I filled "BBQ tanks"
and some RVs for many summers, I'm certainly not an expert. I do take a
perverse pleasure in advising the (usually) teens who fill my tank these
days, making some of the same mistakes I once made (last time: forgot to
reset the counter. Previous: tried to thread in a BBQ tank fill nozzle
without an RV adaptor).

I believe that a tank with a valve left open for a while (say, weeks)
when discharged of propane to the point that the pressure in the tank is
equal to air pressure (empty in practical terms but not completely
empty--not a vacuum) should be purged. However, if you close the valve
to the tank when you run out of propane, you can refill without purging,
and can do so repeatedly.

Here's how I understand it:
New "BBQ tanks" (you know, those that take ten pounds of LP) usually
arrive with some plain ol' air of some sort blown in. Whatever the best
way is to get this out may be, the way most filling stations will get
this air out (along with any other impurities, say, particles from its
construction) is to let out any pressure that was added by the factory
by opening the valve until air stops rushing out, then partly filling
the tank (say, two pounds--not so much that the valve freezes during the
next step), then discharging it (often, holding the tank upside down),
repeat, repeat, and fill. BBQ Tanks filled w/out purging will not accept
10 lbs of gas (or will do so only under excessive pressure, which should
engage a release valve anyhow), and will not maintain a flame when it
counts--when those steaks are thawed! Tanks purged in this way probably
aren't completely purged, but work very well just the same. Takes 10
minutes tops. If the BBQ grill runs out of LP and the user (being BBQ
savvy enough two own a full backup tank) takes the empty LP tank off and
puts it in the shed without closing the valve, the tank, tending like
all (?) things in the universe toward equilibrium in environmental
conditions that continually vary, will eventually collect some moisture
and non-LP gas (air) in the tank and will need purging.

I'm not sure how similar our systems are to a BBQ system--I suspect air
and moisture would have more difficulty getting into the tank (because
it remains attached to the rest of the system), but probably could over
time if the valve were left open. I'm not sure if the propane we add to
our tanks contains some moisture that would add up over many fills. My
advice is to get the tank purged one way or another if you're unsure
about the purity of the gas in your tank. Then, if you are good about
turning off the valve, don't worry about purging again for a few years,
even if you run out now and then.

Insert statement re: value of two pennies here. Looking forward to
additions and corrections from those who know more.

Good luck cookin'

-George

Bulley wrote:
>
> A thing I learnt recently about propane tanks...
>
> In order for the propane system to work properly, if the tank is completely
> empty, it must first be "purged" before filling. We have our tank off being
> blasted/coated right now, and the propane guy who does my tank stuff told
> me about it. Basically what it means is they suck all the air and moisture
> out of the tank by pulling a vacuum on it for about ten minutes.
>
> The rational is that whatever moisture and air is present in the empty tank
> has only one way out, through your burner orifices. Bad performance for a
> long while. You may want to consider having the tank purged, if it is empty
> now.
>
> G. Matthew Bulley
> Bulley-Hewlett & Associates
> www.bulley-hewlett.com
> Cary, NC USA
> 888.468.4880 tollfree
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From:   Tony Peet [SMTP:tpvw@HOTMAIL.COM]
> Sent:   Tuesday, August 10, 1999 9:25 PM
> To:     vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM
> Subject:        Fwd: Re: Propane (East Coast)
>
> If you want to save some time and don't suspect system trouble,why not just
> go ahead and fill up the tank?  You'll have more than enough for a week of
> camping.  (I took a three week camping trip, had the fridge on propane the
> whole time and used the stove an average of twice a day for boiling water.
> When I filled up the tank three days before the end just to be sure, I
> still
> had .7 gallon left!)
>
> Also, there is a website that will locate propane dealers.  I don't know
> the
> URL, but if you do a search I'm sure it will come up.
>
> Tony
>
> >From: David Bogle <bogle@BWAY.NET>
> >Reply-To: David Bogle <bogle@BWAY.NET>
> >To: vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM
> >Subject: Re: Propane (East Coast)
> >Date: Tue, 10 Aug 1999 19:24:35 -0400
> >
> >Greeting collective,
> >
> >Though my system is rusty, it works; but, I have never had it filled or
> >had it looked at by a propane professional.  I need to at least
> >determine how much fuel I have for my week of camping coming up.  I'll
> >be a ferry ride away from finding propane, so I can't just wait until I
> >run out.
> >
> >Anybody know a _good_ propane place anwhere from Washington/Baltimore
> >area and Cape Hatteras/Cape Lookout NC, via Norfolk, VA?  Not too far
> >off the Interstate preferably.
> >
> >TIA,
> >David Bogle
> >Brooklyn
> >'87 Syncro Westfalia
>
> _______________________________________________________________
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