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Date:         Fri, 29 Oct 1999 21:05:12 +0000
Reply-To:     Jim Arnott <jrasite@EONI.COM>
Sender:       Vanagon Mailing List <vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com>
From:         Jim Arnott <jrasite@EONI.COM>
Organization: DreamCatcher
Subject:      Re: wondering out loud (several questions) in Colorado
Comments: To: Jon Sykes <jonandbarb@YAHOO.COM>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; x-mac-type="54455854";
              x-mac-creator="4D4F5353"

Okay Jon, I'll give it a shot...

Jon Sykes wrote:

> > - The last Type2's and <= 83.5 Vanagons share the > same air-cooled engine, I believe; however, do they > share the same transmission (the Vanagon looks a > little heavier, so I was wondering if the ratios > changed at all)?

Don't know about the ratios, but the transmissions are the same but different. Both are the "091" gearboxes but the shifting mechanism is different between the two. The pre '80 gearbox shifter connects through the nose of the transaxle like VW's have done since 1939. The post-'79 gearbox has a 'side-shifter' like is used on most later air-cooled Porsches. They are not, to my knowledge, interchangeable.

> > - Does the Vanagon air-cooled have a greater or worse > gas consumption, or is it unchanged (officially)?

I can't speak to the air-cooled Vanagon, but my '77 ASI camper gets about 17 mpg and my '83.5 wasserboxer Vanagon GL gets about 19 mpg.

> > - Is the Westfalia camper equipment unchanged between > the two models (could I take the units out of a 83 > Vanagon and put it in a 78 Type2)?

No data...

> > - Is the engine any easier or harder to remove > between the two different body styles?

Once again, I'll compare apples and oranges. The engine in the '77 is a PIA to get out, relatively speaking. Cramped working quarters. The wasserboxer is almost as easy to remove as a type 1 engine. But it would be... That's almost what it is... The Vanagon has a BIG hole over the top.

> > - I've heard of several replacement engines for the > Vanagon (5-Cyl Audi, TDi, Golf, Subaru, etc) - but I'm > not sure if all of these bolt right onto the existing > transmission or not. Some seem to need the diesel > tranny? What about Type2 replacement engines?

All of the inline VW engine conversions seem to need the Diesel components. The Diesel that was installed in the early Vanagons was the same engine (I believe) as was used in the Diesel Rabbits of the same vintage. The Rabbit Diesel was built to fit in exactly the same hole as the gas version, so is externally identical. Using the Diesel Vanagon parts means very little fabrication is necessary to perform the swap. Using another manufacturer's engine seems to me to be a way to spend a whole lot of money to end up with something that might not be saleable. Another way to put it is ask if replacing that problematic 12 cylinder in your Jaguar with an absolutely stone reliable Chevy 350 enhances the value of the automobile... (Trust me, it doesn't.)

Type 2 replacement engines are available from a number of sources. Great subject to scour the archives for.

> > - Particularly in the water-cooled model, using a > different engine seems to be a more economical way of > keeping the bus running. Any dead waterboxer Vanagons > Westfalias for sale in CO?

You hear many horror stories about the wasserboxer motor. You rarely hear the success stories. Our '83.5 has nearly 200,000 miles on it. Was resealed at 148,000 miles. Look at it this way... After ten years and 150,000 miles it blew a head gasket. Head gaskets were the sum total of the repairs. No new heads, no new pistons, cylinders or rings, no new bottom end. I really don't think that one can expect better longevity than this.

There are about 800 people on the list. I don't believe that there's a single Subaru conversion owner here, and there are only a couple of inline conversion owners. I don't need to ask myself why. $$$

> > - can the engine be removed (better yet, replaced) by > just one person? How long does it take, ballpark?

Vanagon, about an hour by myself (wasserboxer). Loaf, about the same. THe loaf is just 'fiddlier'.

> > - any VW Clubs in Colorado (that don't just cater to > the current VW lineup)? > > I'm looking for a cared for 78 - 83.5 Westie, with all > the camping equipment, within a few hundred miles of > Denver. I don't mind doing some minor engine > overhauling, minor rust or interior tidy-ups (to be > expected) as long as the whole thing is pretty sound. > > This is probably a harder question to answer, but > what's a good price? I know that's like asking how > long is a piece of string, but I've seen seemingly the > same bus for $2000 and $4000. Are these things > skyrocketing in value as we speak? Fast approaching > "classic" status, maybe? I'd be interested in hearing > what others paid for theirs over the last year and any > recommendations. >

I spent $2500 for the '77 a couple of years ago. Considered it a fair price. Spent $3400 for the Vanagon in '93 with leaking heads. Probably a fair price then...

Good luck in your search.

Jim Arnott WetWesties Union, OR


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