Nope, shouldn't be. Sounds to me like you = probably have sticky lifters. Try the ATF trick. One = caveat, though - if your engine is worn, it can increase blow-by (and = reduce compression) because it will tend to remove some of the varnish = and carbon in bottom end of the cylinders and your rings (at least the = bottom ones). It all may be more effort than it is worth. = What grade of oil are you using? If you are using too light of an = oil, that can cause problems, too. (i.e. 10-30 is too light = according to many here on the list. I run Castrol = 20w-50)
Do you have to pull the heads on a WB motor to get to = the lifters? I would imagine so, but if not (i.e. you have those = telescopic push rod tubes) you may be able to just squirt some sort of = solvent into the lifters to help free them up. Then change the = oil a couple of times and see if that helps.
Keep in mind that when you hear lifter noise, it is = an indication of excessive clearance between the lifter and the push = rod, which also means that the valves are not opening as early and as = far as they should be. This will decrease performance (though = maybe imperceptibly) and tend to increase fouling and other = combustion-related problems.
That being said, I have driven cars with mal-adjusted = and clattering valves for thousands of miles...
Brent Christensen
'89 GL Syncro Westy
Santa Barbara, CA
-----Original Message-----
From: Mark Rissman [mailto:rissman@winresources.com=
]
Sent: Monday, March 27, 2000 2:32 PM
To: 'BRENT CHRISTENSEN'; Mark Rissman
Cc: Vanagon List (E-mail)
Subject: RE: lifter noise
I am using genuine VW oil filter from the =
dealer. Are those a problem?
- Mark Rissman
83.5 Westy
-----Original Message-----
From: BRENT CHRISTENSEN [mailto:bchristensen@infogen=
esis.com]
Sent: Monday, March 27, 2000 1:10 PM
To: 'Mark Rissman'
Cc: Vanagon List (E-mail)
Subject: RE: lifter noise
If you are using the wrong oil filter, then you = should worry about it, since the period of time that your lifters are = making all that noise, the engine is likely running without proper oil = pressure (and therefore lubrication to critical areas). This can = be deadly for areas like main bearings, connecting rods, and = cams.
If the problem is instead related to "sticky =
lifters" then it is not really a big deal except the engine can =
run pretty crappy until the lifters "pump up" and you get the =
correct valve clearance. (I used to notice this particularly with =
Corvairs, which are pretty similar in design to the 1.9L Vanagon motor =
AFAIK). They would barely run until the lifters stopped =
clattering, then the idle would magically even out and purr like a =
kitten. (Well, OK, like a kitten with four one-barrel carbs that =
were perpetually out of sync...)
Brent Christensen
'89 GL Syncro Westy
Santa Barbara, CA
Former owner of '62 Corvair Monza "Spyder" =
turbo (150hp) and '65 Corvair Corsair convertible (140hp) Both of =
them never left "project" status... :-(
-----Original Message-----
From: Mark Rissman [mailto:rissman@winresources.com=
]
Sent: Monday, March 27, 2000 12:35 PM
To: 'BRENT CHRISTENSEN'; =
'vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM'
Subject: RE: lifter noise
Brent,
Do I care about those lifters being that way? =
The problem is only when I start the car and don't drive it off for the =
day. (when moving in the driveway)
- Mark Rissman
83.5 Westy
-----Original Message-----
From: BRENT CHRISTENSEN [mailto:bchristensen@infogen=
esis.com]
Sent: Monday, March 27, 2000 9:51 AM
To: 'Mark Rissman'; =
'vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM'
Subject: RE: lifter noise
First of all, make sure you are using the right oil =
filter (Mahle or Mann with anti-drain back valve).
That being said, I don't know about Vanagons, but =
this sounds like classic "sticky lifter" syndrome caused by =
carbon/dirt/sludge that builds up in the lifter valving.
The cheapest fix for this that I know of (and have = used on older American cars) is to drain the oil out of the engine and = refill it with a blend of fresh oil and ATF (believe it or not). = The ATF is very high in detergents and tends to help break up the = sludge. You run it like this for a few hours (I don't recommend = sustained freeway driving, as the lubricating properties of ATF are not = the same as motor oil!). Just let it sit and idle for a while = until it gets good and hot. Then drain and repeat this process. =
I have run about a 60% success rate using this method =
on the following cars (as best as I can remember):
Corvairs (3)
'66 Plymouth Fury Wagon
Ford 2.3L Pinto
Jeep V-6
A couple of misc. Oldsmobiles and Buicks, and I =
think a Nash Metropolitan...
The other alternative is obviously to replace all =
the lifters. Not expensive (usually) but a major PITA, since it =
involves about the same amount of work as rebuilding the engine =
entirely.
Brent Christensen
'89 GL Syncro Westy
Santa Barbara, CA
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Vanagon Mailing List [mailto:vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.C=
OM]On Behalf
> Of Mark Rissman
> Sent: Monday, March 27, 2000 9:19 AM
> To: vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM
> Subject: lifter noise
>
>
> I think I have a similar problem on my 83.5 =
water cooled. If
> I start the
> motor up without driving (moving in driveway), =
I get a noisy
> lifter. The
> only way I fix it is by taking it out on the =
freeway for 10 minutes.
>
> - Mark Rissman
> 83.5 Westy
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Animal [mailto:terrapin@HALIFAX.COM] =
> Sent: Sunday, March 26, 2000 9:15 AM
> To: vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM
> Subject: lifter noise
>
>
> Due the purchase of a 78 scirocco to serve as =
my daily driver, I
> haven't been driving my 80 westy for about =
three weeks.
> I went out to fire it up the other day, one of =
my lifters
> wouldn't pump up.
> I let it run for awhile, but it still raised =
all manner of noise.
> I realize this has probably been covered =
somewhere in the past, but
> any quick suggestions on what I can do to get =
that puppy to pump back
> up would be greatly appreciated.
> On another front, while I have your attention, =
the ignition switch
> has gone out on my 85 vanagon and I can't for =
the life of me figure
> out how to get that fool thing out.
> For the moment it's just sitting, the key =
turns, but none of the
> magic noises happen. I think its more of the =
actual tumblers worn out
> than anything else, cause there are no clicks =
that you would normally
> run into when turning the key.
> Once again, suggestions appreciated.
> And finally, unrelated to the vanagon, but =
volkswagon related
> nonetheless, anyone know where you can get =
speedometers repaired.
> The one on the scirocco, the speed works, but =
the odometer is busted.
> I took it out and the main gear on the shaft, =
where the numbers are,
> won't spin.
> The gear that you can remove from the shaft, is =
tight and spins the
> shaft, but that first gear just spins.
> I haven't been able to a drop of glue on it to =
see if that would lock
> it down, and I haven't had any luck searching =
boneyards for a used
> one.
> It wouldn't really matter except at work I'm =
reimbursed for mileage
> and if the numbers don't spin, I don't get =
paid.
> Also the gas gauge doesn't work so every 24 =
hours, I fill up the car.
> I'm located in southside Virginia.
> Help.
> Onward thru the fog
> David Conner
> terrapin@halifax.com
>