Date: Wed, 8 May 2002 14:06:52 -0400
Reply-To: Jason Willenbrock <pooncerelli@HOTMAIL.COM>
Sender: Vanagon Mailing List <vanagon@gerry.vanagon.com>
From: Jason Willenbrock <pooncerelli@HOTMAIL.COM>
Subject: Re: Tempurature
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<P>karl,</P>
<P>this is the exact information that was relayed to me by my vw mechanic friend. for four years now and many many cross country trips under full load in the summer going up and down the mountains, my needle will eventually always sit at 3/4 up and sometimes higher. i keep on driving the same for another 10 to 12 hours and never once a problem with my cooling sysytem. in my opinion this is how they work and i never have let it concern me. i always check all my cooling lines and coolant level and everything else related- i fix what is needed and leave everything else alone. i never needed head gasket replacement. my original engine went over 200k and head gaskets never needed replacing, and i always ran it with the vw 87 tstat. that is my factual information not opinion. i find it hard to believe that vw would create a part for these vans that would actually make them hot to the point of drying out the head gaskets.</P>
<P>jason</P>
<P>90gl<BR><BR></P></DIV>
<DIV></DIV>
<DIV></DIV>>From: Karl Wolz <WOLZPHOTO@WORLDNET.ATT.NET>
<DIV></DIV>>Reply-To: Karl Wolz <WOLZPHOTO@WORLDNET.ATT.NET>
<DIV></DIV>>To: vanagon@GERRY.VANAGON.COM
<DIV></DIV>>Subject: Re: Tempurature
<DIV></DIV>>Date: Wed, 8 May 2002 10:51:40 -0700
<DIV></DIV>>
<DIV></DIV>>Ben,
<DIV></DIV>>
<DIV></DIV>>Usually you are a source of good information, but this time, not so good.
<DIV></DIV>>
<DIV></DIV>>First, the high speed fan kicks in at the correct temperature; that is when
<DIV></DIV>>climbing a long steep grade or a similar situation where the engine is being
<DIV></DIV>>stressed beyond normal limits.
<DIV></DIV>>
<DIV></DIV>>If you are having problems with your cooling system, perhaps your radiator
<DIV></DIV>>is clogged, or you may have an air bubble in the system. The Vanagon
<DIV></DIV>>cooling system works quite well, and really does not need to be tinkered
<DIV></DIV>>with.
<DIV></DIV>>
<DIV></DIV>>You may drive it all day with the gauge at 3/4. Nothing really wrong with
<DIV></DIV>>that. Should it continue to climb above that point, it is good to keep a
<DIV></DIV>>sharp eye on it, and be prepared to pull over IMMEDIATELY should you get the
<DIV></DIV>>dreaded blinking red LED.
<DIV></DIV>>
<DIV></DIV>>Second, if you choose to use the lower temperature thermostat, be prepared
<DIV></DIV>>to lose about 2 miles per gallon of gas. The entire fuel injection system
<DIV></DIV>>is tuned for the correct t'stat.
<DIV></DIV>>
<DIV></DIV>>
<DIV></DIV>>Karl Wolz
<DIV></DIV>>
<DIV></DIV>>----- Original Message -----
<DIV></DIV>>From: "Ben huot" <HUOTX@VIDEOTRON.CA>
<DIV></DIV>>To: <VANAGON@GERRY.VANAGON.COM>
<DIV></DIV>>Sent: Wednesday, May 08, 2002 10:16 AM
<DIV></DIV>>Subject: Re: Tempurature
<DIV></DIV>>
<DIV></DIV>>
<DIV></DIV>> > On my 87 there is only 2 speeds, the lower one come ON at the upper part
<DIV></DIV>>of
<DIV></DIV>> > the cooling level light and the high speed at about 3/4, this is to
<DIV></DIV>>high!(I
<DIV></DIV>> > have a manual switch for the second speed)
<DIV></DIV>> >
<DIV></DIV>> > The engine temperature should be about the same in wintertime and summer
<DIV></DIV>> > time on a Westy and on most car. This is the reason we have thermostat on
<DIV></DIV>> > our vehicle, in winter time the thermo is mostly or partially close. In
<DIV></DIV>> > summer time or hot temp condition, it is open or partially open to
<DIV></DIV>>maintain
<DIV></DIV>> > the perfect temperature. So the needle should always be at the same
<DIV></DIV>> > position, especially at cruising speed.
<DIV></DIV>> >
<DIV></DIV>> > In heavy traffic it is normal that the temperature climbs a bit but the
<DIV></DIV>>rad
<DIV></DIV>> > fan should regulated the temperature just above the cooling light. The
<DIV></DIV>>temp
<DIV></DIV>> > should go down as fast as she went up when you star driving forward. NEVER
<DIV></DIV>> > RUN THIS VAN AT 3/4 GAUGE READING
<DIV></DIV>> >
<DIV></DIV>> > The new VW OEM gauge temp sensor give a higher READING, about +10% more,
<DIV></DIV>> > the new OEM thermo maintain a higher temperature, about +15%, VW Canada
<DIV></DIV>> > told me that the engine was running to cold before-------bullshit. (So
<DIV></DIV>>what
<DIV></DIV>> > you see in the front dash gauge whit those new parts is an increase of
<DIV></DIV>> > about 20-25% on the dash gauge if you change both parts for new OEM parts,
<DIV></DIV>> > not good!
<DIV></DIV>> >
<DIV></DIV>> > Monitor closely the condition of the Water pump, thermostat and front
<DIV></DIV>> > radiator. A partially clogged front radiator could react slowly and result
<DIV></DIV>> > in a slow temperature change as the coolant is having a hard time flowing
<DIV></DIV>> > trough this one.
<DIV></DIV>> >
<DIV></DIV>> > Have a pressure test done on the cooling system, look for leak, internal
<DIV></DIV>>or
<DIV></DIV>> > external.
<DIV></DIV>> >
<DIV></DIV>> > Special note:
<DIV></DIV>> > I met a very nice fellow the past weekend; he had a simple solution to the
<DIV></DIV>> > head gasket-leaking problem and other "dried oil seal problem" on VW van.
<DIV></DIV>> > Lower temperature thermostat!!!
<DIV></DIV>> >
<DIV></DIV>> > This guy is an old VW mechanic; he worked 30 years with the same VW dealer
<DIV></DIV>> > (and of course is speciality was the flat-4). He now buy and sell
<DIV></DIV>> > vanagon-Westy for pleasure (he says that the older model are to rusty). He
<DIV></DIV>> > personally owns a 90GL (in perfect condition with only 45k miles and a
<DIV></DIV>>1966
<DIV></DIV>> > bus with the small scare pop top (A beauty). He confirms what I was
<DIV></DIV>> > thinking; the normal operating temperature on a vanagon is to high with
<DIV></DIV>>the
<DIV></DIV>> > new VW 87deg thermostat, the flexible heads gasket dry-up (I should say
<DIV></DIV>> > cooked) easily and faster at that temperature. This guy did more head
<DIV></DIV>> > change that all of us join together. He as nothing to prove, he is very
<DIV></DIV>> > discreet and don't talk much. But he is always carrying a photos album
<DIV></DIV>>whit
<DIV></DIV>> > over 15 different westy that he owns over the past 35 years. Sadly he
<DIV></DIV>> > doesn't know shit about Internet. He also stated that the lack of fresh
<DIV></DIV>>air
<DIV></DIV>> > as always been the problem on all the VW rear engine van, even the
<DIV></DIV>> > water-cooled.
<DIV></DIV>> > Note that this is not my personal comment, it's a professional VW mechanic
<DIV></DIV>> > comment, and I should add a truly westy lover.
<DIV></DIV>> >
<DIV></DIV>> > Since he started putting lower thermostat on all the van he sells (long
<DIV></DIV>> > time ago-10years), he never he had to replace a head gasket. His words!
<DIV></DIV>> >
<DIV></DIV>> > My conclusion:
<DIV></DIV>> > The hell with VW new higher temperature thermostat, get the 80-82deg
<DIV></DIV>> > thermostat from Bus depot or other good parts dealer, monitor your cooling
<DIV></DIV>> > system carefully, change parts before they break, add oil pressure sender,
<DIV></DIV>> > temp oil sender and gauge to your van. Change the coolant each 2 years.
<DIV></DIV>> > Rebuilt engine are getting rare and expensive.
<DIV></DIV>> >
<DIV></DIV>> > You are better off cooler than to hot!
<DIV></DIV>> >
<DIV></DIV>> > My 2cents, Ben
<DIV></DIV>> > http://www3.sympatico.ca/huotx/engine1.htm
<DIV></DIV>> >
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